DeepSeek Nears $12B Funding Round Ahead of Potential IPO

Author: Bloomberg Television · Watch on YouTube

Video authored by the channel shown, not by IANIA; all rights belong to the creator. Transcript and summary generated automatically; the original-language content is preserved.

Original language: English

Original video: DeepSeek Nears $12B Funding Round Ahead of Potential IPO · Channel: Bloomberg Television · 1:32:31 · Watch on YouTube

Topics: Markets and economy, Multimodal models, AI safety

Summary

Bloomberg reports that DeepSeek is nearing a funding round of at least $12 billion, backed by Tencent and CATL, as it prepares for a potential IPO and races to compete with U.S. AI companies. The program also examines uneven Asian market performance, with Taiwan outperforming South Korea, while Hong Kong stocks and Chinese technology shares struggle to follow Wall Street’s AI rally. Guests discuss bond-market risks, oil supply disruptions, Bitcoin and prediction markets, smart glasses, and Coinbase’s expansion into tokenized assets. Jamie Dimon warns that AI is increasing cybersecurity risks and says companies need to work together to protect critical infrastructure.

Key points

DeepSeek is reported to be raising at least 80 billion yuan, or about $12 billion, with Tencent and CATL among the major investors; the total could reach 100 billion yuan.
DeepSeek is seeking funding to recruit talent and secure computing resources as it competes with U.S. AI companies, while reportedly planning to keep its models open-source.
Taiwan’s benchmark has overtaken South Korea’s as the year’s strongest major equity market, supported by earnings upgrades and its broad AI supply-chain exposure.
Investors remain heavily positioned against long-dated U.S. Treasuries, with energy costs, government borrowing, and corporate bond issuance cited as risks.
China’s independent oil refiners are turning to Iraqi crude as Iranian supplies are constrained and other alternatives become more expensive.
A Dragonfly partner says crypto venture capital is evolving, and prediction markets could grow further, although legal disputes over state licensing remain.
A smart-glasses maker describes products that connect to OpenAI, Anthropic, and Google AI services, while emphasizing voice recording, user consent, and designs without cameras.
Coinbase says it is building a broader trading platform, expanding into prediction markets and tokenized assets, and sees Asia-Pacific as a major growth region.
Jamie Dimon calls cybersecurity his biggest concern, saying AI models such as Mythos have increased the threat and that businesses should coordinate to protect critical infrastructure.

Chapters

Start	Chapter	Summary
00:01	Asian markets, U.S. rally, and DeepSeek funding	The hosts preview Asian trading, the U.S. market rally, and reports that DeepSeek is nearing a major funding round ahead of a potential IPO.
04:31	Earnings expectations and Treasury positioning	Bloomberg’s Asia editor discusses expected earnings growth, Taiwan’s upgrades, and bearish positioning in U.S. Treasuries.
07:11	DeepSeek’s funding round and AI ambitions	Reporters describe DeepSeek’s fundraising, its major backers, plans for an IPO, and its intended use of Huawei accelerators.
11:10	Milken Asia Summit and crypto outlook	The program previews discussions in Singapore on crypto regulation, AI privacy, and trade, then airs remarks on Singapore’s emphasis on trust.
16:42	Jamie Dimon on AI investment and cybersecurity	Dimon discusses AI’s economic potential, the cost and location of data centers, and the growing cybersecurity risks associated with AI.
22:13	Hong Kong market open and sector moves	The hosts track a subdued Hong Kong session, with technology and biotech shares weak despite U.S. gains and DeepSeek’s reported fundraising.
26:36	Taiwan outperforms South Korea	A reporter explains Taiwan’s market outperformance through earnings momentum, diversified AI suppliers, and demand from U.S. hyperscalers.
31:28	China’s crude supplies and oil prices	Bloomberg examines China’s oil inventories and explains why independent refiners are buying Iraqi crude amid constrained supplies and high prices.
36:00	Bitcoin, crypto venture capital, and prediction markets	A Dragonfly partner discusses renewed retail interest in crypto, the changing venture landscape, prediction-market growth, and regulatory challenges.
45:10	Asian trading and the AI market’s breadth	Market guests describe losses in Asian tech and biotech, sector rotation into industrials, and ongoing questions about concentration in the AI rally.
53:21	DeepSeek’s shift toward external financing	A guest considers why DeepSeek is seeking outside capital, how it may balance commercial and strategic goals, and the importance of institutional IPO investors.
58:03	Smart glasses, AI, and privacy	The CEO of a smart-glasses company discusses adoption, AI integrations, privacy safeguards, manufacturing, and international markets.
1:08:09	Market headlines and Coinbase’s crypto strategy	After market headlines, Coinbase’s international co-CEO discusses unified trading liquidity, product expansion, tokenization, and growth in Asia-Pacific.
1:23:20	India rate decision and Dimon’s AI warning	The program previews India’s rate decision and returns to Dimon’s comments on data centers, AI’s benefits, and the need to address cybersecurity vulnerabilities.
1:31:27	Closing market update	The hosts review weakness in Southeast Asian banks, Hong Kong healthcare and technology shares, and the coming China market reopening.

Quotes

he still wants to keep the company’s models as open-source. — 10:00

Trust is the coin of the realm. — 14:25

AI has these huge positive effects. — 19:55

Cyber is our biggest risk. — 21:02

It went up tenfold after Mythos. — 1:31:27

Concepts and entities

DeepSeek, Tencent, CATL, Huawei, Mythos, NVIDIA, Coinbase, Polymarket, Kalshi, Jamie Dimon, smart glasses, tokenização, mercados de previsão, aceleradores Huawei

Full transcript (original language)

00:01 YVONNE: 9:00 A.M. IN SHANGHAI, SHENZHEN, AND HERE IN HONG KONG. MINMIN: WE ARE COUNTING DOWN TO THE OPENING OF MARKETS IN HONG KONG, BUT MAY LEAD MARKETS ARE SHUT. ASIAN STOCKS FLAT DESPITE A MARKET RALLY DRIVING THE S&P 500 TO ITS FIRST RECORD CLOSE SINCE AUGUST. BLOOMBERG LEARNS DEEPSEEK IS NEARING A 12 BILLION TO FUNDING HALL WITH TENCENT AND ATL BACKING THE START UP AHEAD OF

00:34 ITS PLANNED IPO. MINMIN: JAMIE DIMON WEIGHS IN, TELLING BLOOMBERG THAT RISKS HAVE GONE UP TENFOLD DUE TO ANTHROPIC’S MYTHOS MODEL. YVONNE: IT’S INTERESTING, WE ARE NOT QUITE GETTING THOSE TAIL WINDS FROM THE U.S., RIGHT?

01:07 YOU TALK ABOUT THE S&P FIRST RECORDS SINCE AUGUST, TALKING ABOUT NVIDIA COMING BACK NEARING THAT $6 TRILLION MARKET CAP. MAYBE MORE OF A MUTED START. MINMIN: I THINK A LOT OF GAINS IN THE U.S. ARE DRIVEN BY DOMESTIC NAMES. TECH NAMES HAVE BEEN DOING VERY WELL. THAT MARKET CAP PUSH HIGHER BUT IN ASIA, YOU ARE NOT REALLY

01:40 SEEING THAT FEEDTHROUGH, MAINLY BECAUSE MEMORY PRICES HAVE BEEN FOR AT LEAST EIGHT SHARES OF THOSE BIG MEMORY CHIP NAMES HAVE BEEN MOVING. THERE’S STILL STRONG DEMAND FOR MEMORY CHIPS. YVONNE: THERE IS STILL A LOT GOING ON. AS YOU SAY, THE STOXX DID NOT DO TOO WELL OVERNIGHT, SO MAYBE THAT’S NOT THAT’S THAT’S WHY WE ARE SEEING KOREA AND TAIWAN NOT OVER PERFORM.

02:16 THE TAIEX VERSUS THE KOSPI, THAT MARGIN IS ABOUT 23 PERCENTAGE POINTS, LAST QUARTER, THE WIDEST MARGIN WE HAVE SEEN SINCE THE TURN-OF-THE-CENTURY. TAIWAN SEEMS TO BE IN FAVOR, BUT NOT TODAY. WE ARE MODERATELY LOWER HERE, BUT SAMSUNG SEEMS TO STAND OUT. EARNINGS COMING OUT ON THURSDAY COULD BE QUITE PIVOTAL ON IF WE CAN CONTINUE WITH THIS AI RALLY. SK HYNIX AND LG ELECTRONICS ARE LOWER THIS MORNING. LG SET TO REPORT ABOUT APPLE AND WORKING TOGETHER WHEN IT COMES TO SOME OF THESE SMART

02:46 HOME PRODUCTS AS WELL. THE B OF A CALL, ARE THE BUBBLE RISKS FORMING? WE ARE SEEING RECORDS ACROSS THE BOARD IN THE U.S.. NVIDIA SUDDENLY IS BACK, BUT IT’S ONLY A HANDFUL OF STOCKS PROPELLING THE NASDAQ TO THOSE RECORDS. TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN TRACKING AND THAT BUBBLE RISK INDICATOR, THE TOP FOUR BUBBLE–ISH CHARACTERISTIC ASSET CLASSES IS THE LIKES OF U.S. TECH, OIL, HEALTH CARE, AND – NO SURPRISE – KOREAN STOCKS.

03:17 MINMIN: JIM POLSON WAS SAYING YOU HAVE THIS TRIPLE WHAMMY OF HIGHER YIELDS, HIGHER RATES, AND THIS IS HISTORICALLY ASSOCIATED WITH A DECLINE IN THE S&P. HE IS CALLING FOR A 20% DECLINE IN TECH STOCKS, AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE BOND MARKET, WE ARE TAKING A BIT OF A PAUSE. YOU SEE A SELLOFF CONTINUE NOW THAT WE HAVE PULLED BACK FROM MONDAY’S HIGHS WHEN IT COMES TO THOSE YIELDS, BUT, YES, IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT MARKET PRICING IS SHOWING US, IF YOU LOOK AT BOND

03:49 FUTURES AND OPEN INTEREST, IT IS STILL SHOWING VERY STRONG INTEREST FOR SHORTING BOND FUTURES, AND THAT’S DESPITE THE COMMENT FROM SCOTT BESSENT THAT HE WANTS TO BEND THE CURVE, THAT THIS FORMULA OF HIGHER GROWTH AND RESTRAINT SPENDING WILL PUT A LID ON GOVERNMENT BORROWING. YVONNE: IF HE CAN DO IT OR NOT IS THE BIG THING. LOOKING AT THE HANG SENG, THERE WAS A MASSIVE RALLY YESTERDAY. WE WILL SEE IF WE GOT ANOTHER DAY OF IT. THE HONG KONG DOLLAR.

04:31 LET’S BRING IN OUR ASIA MANAGING EDITOR. DOES NOT SEEM LIKE WE ARE BREAKING HERE. WE ARE GETTING CLOSE TO THOSE RECORDS. TELL US WHY. >> IT SEEMS INVESTORS ARE MAKING A CONSCIOUS DECISION TO IGNORE THE RIGHTS VOLATILITY. THE ANSWER SEEMS TO LIE IN EARNINGS. IF YOU LOOK AT U.S. STOCKS, BLOOMBERG INTELLIGENCE EXPECTS THIRD-QUARTER EARNINGS TO JUMP 35% FOR S&P 500 COMPANIES AND IN PARTICULAR FOR

05:02 THE TECH SECTOR. THAT EXPECTATION GOES TO 66% JUMP, SO THAT IS A HUGE AMOUNT OF INCREASE EXPECTED. ON TOP OF THAT, GOLDMAN SACHS SAID MOST OF THESE COMPANIES WILL STILL BEAT THE STREET CONSENSUS FOR THEIR EARNINGS. THAT’S WHY YOU SEE THE KIND OF RELENTLESS BID UP FOR GLOBAL STOCKS, BUT COMING BACK TO ASIA, THAT PICTURE IS NOT AS BRIGHT AS THE U.S., I WOULD SAY. UPWARD REVISIONS KIND OF

05:34 SIDELINED A LITTLE BIT, BUT THERE IS ONE BRIGHT SPOT IN ASIA, WHICH IS TAIWAN. YOU GUYS BRIEFLY TOUCHED UPON THAT AS WELL. TAIWAN IS SEEING RAPID EARNINGS UPGRADES RIGHT NOW. IT ACTUALLY HAD OVERTAKEN KOREA’S UPGRADES IN THE THIRD QUARTER, AND THAT’S WHY INVESTORS ARE FAVORING TAIWAN AS ASIA’S MOST FAVORED MARKET RIGHT NOW. >> WE DID SEE A PAUSE IN THE TREASURY SELLOFF A LITTLE BIT, BUT ARE TRADERS BETTING THAT THE SELLOFF IS NOT OVER YET?

06:06 >> IF YOU LOOK AT POSITIONING, THEY ARE BASICALLY TELLING THE STORY THAT PEOPLE ARE HEAVILY BEARISH TOWARD U.S. TREASURIES WITH SHORT POSITIONING AT VERY EXTREME LEVELS. EVEN WITH A RELATIVELY SOFT SET OF JOBS DATA LAST WEEK, WHICH STABILIZED MARKET SOMEWHAT, AS YOU SAY, WE ARE STILL SEEING OPEN INTEREST FOR LONG DATED U.S. TREASURY FUTURES KEEPING GOING UP, AND THAT MEANS FRESH SHORTS ARE COMING INTO THE MARKET. IF YOU LOOK AT THE OPTIONS MARKET, THEY ARE TELLING THE

06:37 SAME STORY. INVESTORS ARE STILL PAYING A PREMIUM TO PROTECT AGAINST A CONTINUED RISE IN LONG DATED TREASURY BOND YIELDS. THE PICTURE IS AGAIN VERY CLEAR, BUT THERE IS A BIT OF STABILIZATION, BUT IF YOU LOOK AHEAD AT THE POSITIONING, TRADERS ARE TELLING US THEY EXPECT MORE PAIN AHEAD FOR BONDS BECAUSE THERE IS THAT VERY DARK BACKDROP OF HIGHER ENERGY PRICES, HIGHER GOVERNMENT SPENDING, AND EVEN HIGHER CORPORATE BOND ISSUANCES

07:11 ALONG WITH THE HIGHER RATE EXPECTATIONS FROM THE U.S. YVONNE: OUR BLOOMBERG MANAGING EDITOR FOR ASIA EQUITIES. THIS MILESTONE WE SEE WITH NVIDIA IS BACK ON THE VERGE OF BECOMING THE FIRST COMPANY WITH A $6 TRILLION MARKET CAP AFTER WHAT WAS A DISAPPOINTING START TO THE YEAR. IT IS UP 30% SO FAR ALREADY, WHICH IS QUITE IMPRESSIVE IF YOU THINK ABOUT HOW WE ENDED THE FIRST QUARTER. THE STOCK WAS DOWN SOME 11% ON THE BACK OF THESE INVESTMENT CONCERNS ON THE BACK OF IF THEY

07:46 WERE SPENDING TOO MUCH ON AI. THEY WERE ABLE TO LAY OUT A PRETTY ROBUST OUTLET – OUTLOOK. THAT HAS PROPELLED THE STOCK HIGHER. MINMIN: IT IS REMARKABLE THAT EVEN AT THAT PRICING, IT IS STILL CONSIDERED CHEAP. HOW STRONGLY EARNINGS OUTLOOK HAS BEEN AND WHAT IS FUELING THAT PRICE HIGHER IS THIS NEWS FOR SPACEX.

08:20 IT JUST GOES TO SHOW YOU, RIGHT, THAT INSATIABLE DEMAND FOR CHIPS TO POWER THEIR COMPUTING REVOLUTION, THE WE ARE SEEING THAT ADDING TO THE LIST OF MASSIVE FINANCING DEALS WE HAVE SEEN OF LATE, NOT JUST IN THE U.S. BUT IN CHINA AS WELL. YVONNE: THIS IS A BIG ONE FROM DEEPSEEK. BUT YOUR TEAM HAS REPORTED DEEPSEEK IS CLOSE TO SECURING AT LEAST $12 BILLION IN THIS LATEST FUNDING ROUND, BLOWING PAST ITS OWN CAPITAL RAISING TARGET AHEAD OF AN PLAN – AN

08:53 IPO PLANNED FOR NEXT YEAR. IT SEEMS THEY WERE ABLE TO RAISE MORE THAN THEY THOUGHT. >> THAT’S RIGHT. THEY RAISED AT LEAST 80 BILLION YUAN, SOARING PAST THEIR PREVIOUS TARGET AND SETTING THE STAGE FOR A POTENTIAL IPO NEXT YEAR. NOW TENCENT AND CATL, THE BATTERY PIONEER, ARE SOME OF THE BIGGEST INVESTORS IN THIS ROUND, AND AS THE COMPANY SIGNS ITS TURN SHEETS, THE TALLY COULD REACH UP TO 100 BILLION YUAN IN THE END. DEEPSEEK IS SITTING AT THE

09:29 CENTER OF A COHORT OF CHINESE AI COMPANIES TRYING TO RACE AGAINST U.S. RIVALS. >> HOW IMPORTANT IS THE ROLE THAT DEEPSEEK AND ITS FOUNDER IS PLAYING? >> DEEPSEEK IS SITTING RIGHT AT THE CENTER, AND RIGHT NOW, EVERYONE IS IN WAR CHEST REPLENISHING MODE. WE REPORTED AS WELL JUST YESTERDAY THAT MOONSHOT OF CLOSING THAT PRE-IPO ROUND AT $50 BILLION VALUATION AND OPENAI RAISING THERE IS A BIT – $30 BILLION, SO THAT’S WHY

10:00 DEEPSEEK NEEDS THIS MONEY, TO ATTRACT THE CAPITAL, THE TALENT, BUT ALSO THE SHIPS IT NEEDS TO COMPLETE THIS RACE. THE FOUNDER ALSO HAS A ROLE TO PLAY. HE HAS HAD A STRONG YEAR, AND NOW, SINCE HE’S OBSESSED WITH AGA I, HE HAS VOWED THAT HE STILL WANTS TO KEEP THE COMPANY’S MODELS AS OPEN-SOURCE. YVONNE: THEY ARE ALSO TEAMING UP WITH THE LIKES OF HUAWEI. HOW DO YOU SEE THESE TWO WORKING TOGETHER?

10:36 >> DEEPSEEK IS PLANNING TO DEPLOY AT LEAST 160,000 HUAWEI ACCELERATORS, BUILDING ONE OF THE LARGEST DATA CENTERS IN MONGOLIA, AND THESE TWO ARE FORWARDING INTO A NEW ARENA. THEY ALSO RELEASED THE SOFTWARE THAT HELPS PROGRAM CHIPS, SO LOTS OF NEW FRONTIERS THERE. YVONNE: I GUESS IT BUILDS ONTO THE ANTICIPATION OF THIS IPO HAPPENING EARLY NEXT YEAR.

11:10 THANK YOU. CERTAINLY THAT WILL BE A BIG THING TO WATCH, NOT JUST FUNDRAISING CYCLES OF THESE AI COMPANIES, BUT REALLY THE INVESTMENT IN AI HAS BEEN THE TOPIC AT THE SUMMIT NOW UNDERWAY IN SINGAPORE. ALSO UNDER WAY, BITCOIN’S LATEST RALLY PROVIDES TALKS OF MAY ANOTHER BULL MARKET. MINMIN: LET US BRING IN HASLINDA AMIN. AVRIL HONG IS AT THE MILKEN

11:40 ASIA SUMMIT. TELL US WHAT’S COMING UP. HASLINDA: EXPECT AT A LOT OF BUZZ. WERE TALKING 25,000 PARTICIPANTS, MOVERS AND SHAKERS DESCENDING HERE IN THE LION CITY, AMID A LOT OF EXPECTATION. YVONNE MENTIONED WE COULD SEE THE END OF THE CRYPTO FREEZE. TAKE A LOOK AT WHERE IT IS TRADING RIGHT NOW. IT IS UP ABOUT 40% JUST SOME THREE MONTHS AGO, BUT THE QUESTION REMAINS, WHERE IT GOES

12:14 FROM HERE. DESPITE A PRESIDENT WHO IS PRO-CRYPTO, WE ARE SEEING THAT REGULATION IN THE U.S. HAS BEEN SLOW, BUT WE ARE MAKING PROGRESS ESPECIALLY IN HONG KONG AS WELL AS SINGAPORE. WE EXPECT FRAMEWORKS FROM LICENSING TO COME THROUGH, AND THAT WILL HELP THE EXPLOSION, PERHAPS, THE GROWTH OF CRYPTOCURRENCIES. WE ARE SPEAKING TO A SLEW OF MOVERS AND SHAKERS. THE LIKES OF COINBASE, DRAGONFLY, AND REMEMBER, NOW WE

12:45 HAVE TRADITIONAL FINANCE PRETTY MUCH IN THE LOOP. WE ARE SPEAKING TO FRANKLIN TEMPLETON TO SEE WHAT IT SEES AS PROSPECTS FOR THE COMPANY GOING FORWARD. YVONNE: IT SEEMS VERY INTERESTING. YOU GUYS CERTAINLY STOLE THE SPOTLIGHT FROM HONG KONG TODAY. >> – MINMIN: WHEN IT COMES TO FRAMEWORKS, GUARD RAILS. TALK ABOUT ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE AND TO SOME

13:17 EXTENT, THERE ARE CONCERNS ABOUT PRIVACY, INCLUDING WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WEARABLE SMART GLASSES, SO WE WILL BE TALKING TO A CEO OF NAI-POWERED SMART GLASSES COMPANY THAT IS LOOKING TO INCREASE ITS U.S. MARKET SHARE. WHAT ARE SOME OF THE BOTTLENECKS THAT HE SEES IN THE MARKET, AT A TIME WHERE THERE ARE THESE CONCERNS ABOUT AI AND HOW IT COULD AFFECT PRIVACY. YOU HAVE THE LIKES OF AUSTRALIA CALLING THEM PERVERT GLASSES. ASIDE FROM THAT, WE ARE ALSO

13:48 CONTINUING TO TALK TRADE. WE HAVE JUST HEARD FROM THE SINGAPORE FOREIGN MINISTER TALKING ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN U.S. AND CHINA. THE MINISTER OF INTERNATIONAL TRADE TALKED ABOUT HOW COUNTRIES ARE LOOKING FOR RELIABLE PARTNERS, AND WITH THAT IN MIND, CANADA HAS A LOT TO OFFER. THOSE CONVERSATIONS TAKING PLACE AT THIS EVENT IN THE LION CITY. YVONNE: LET’S STAY WHERE YOU ARE BECAUSE WE ARE ABOUT TO SEE THE

14:25 FOREIGN MINISTER OF SINGAPORE NOW SPEAKING ON STAGE. LET’S LISTEN IN. >> ADOPT TECHNOLOGIES AND REGULATE THEM IN A WAY THAT PEOPLE CONSTRUCT THAT CAN TRUST. >> STRUCK ON THAT WORD. TRUST IS THE COIN OF THE REALM. AT A TIME OF GREAT DISRUPTION, TRUST BECOMES EVEN MORE VALUABLE. WHATEVER HAPPENS, WE INTEND TO MAINTAIN OUR PREMIUM ON TRUST,

14:58 ON NOT PANICKING. CERTAINLY NEVER CONFISCATING WEALTH PROPERLY EARNED AND MANAGED. NOT PANICKING IN A CRISIS, AND JUST KEEPING OUR HEADS AND MAINTAINING SANCTITY OF CONTRACT AND CONSISTENT APPLICATION OF LAWS, BOTH DOMESTIC AND INTERNATIONAL, AND KEEPING SUFFICIENT LEVEL OF TRANSPARENCY IN OUR SYSTEMS. IN

15:32 FACT, WE THINK THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US. FOR THE CROWD IN THIS ROOM, WE LOOK AT MANAGING ASSETS AND WEALTH. WE ARE DOING QUITE WELL, AND IT’S NOT BECAUSE WE ARE THE SMARTEST OR BIGGEST HOUR MOST POWERFUL PEOPLE IN THE ROOM, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO BELIEVE SINGAPORE HAS A REAL TRUST PREMIUM, AND WE WILL DOUBLE DOWN ON THIS. >> ONCE PEOPLE BUY INTO THAT TRUST FRAMEWORK, HOW – OR DO

16:04 YOU THINK THE CITIZENS ARE EQUIPPED TO ADAPT – MINMIN: WE WILL LEAVE YOU THERE, BUT BLOOMBERG SUBSCRIBERS FIND MORE ON LIV GOLF. A REMINDER THAT MAINLAND CHINA MARKETS REMAIN SHUT FOR THE GOLDEN WEEK. TODAY IS THE LAST DAY OF THAT, BUT WE ARE COUNTING DOWN TO THE OPENING TRADE IN HONG KONG. THIS IS OPEN THE THE CHINA SHOW.”

16:42 YVONNE: JPMORGAN CHASE CEO JAMIE DIMON SAYS CYBERSECURITY REMAINS HIS BIGGEST CONCERN IS ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE CREATES NEW RISKS AND VULNERABILITIES. SPEAKING EXCLUSIVELY WITH BLOOMBERG, HE WEIGHED IN ON THE MOUNTING INVESTMENT NEEDED TO FUEL THE AI BUILDOUT. >> THIS CONFERENCE, THERE SHOULD BE 20 PEOPLE. NOW 2000 INVESTORS AND COMPANIES AROUND THE WORLD, AND IT IS A POSITIVE SIGN OF TECH’S ABILITY TO EXPAND, NOT JUST

17:16 SILICON VALLEY, BUT IT’S EVERYWHERE. THAT’S A GOOD SIGN. A LOT OF THESE COMPANIES, THEY ARE THINGS THAT HAVE HELPED MANKIND FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS, BUT RATES ARE GOING UP. A LOT OF DEMAND FOR CAPITAL. IN MY VIEW, A LITTLE BIT EXPECTED. IT CREATES RISK FOR ALL COMPANIES. MARKETS OPEN AND CLOSE, SO THERE’S NO PERMANENT STATE OF AFFAIRS WHEN IT COMES TO MARKETS.

17:47 >> WE HAVE ALL SEEN THE INCREASED COMPETITION FOR CAPITAL. LAYERING THAT ON THE CAPEX SPEND , WHAT IS THE POTENTIAL BIGGEST RISK TO THAT FORECAST? IS IT PHYSICAL BUILDOUT, MONETIZATION, THE COST OF CAPITAL OR IS IT SOMETHING ELSE? >> IT IS ALL THOSE THINGS. WHEN WE MENTION THE INTERNET, IN TOTAL IT PAYS OFF, BUT THERE WILL BE BETTER MODELS, CHANGING SCHEDULES, LAWSUITS ABOUT DATA

18:20 CENTERS. MOST OF THEM WILL BE BUILT AND PROBABLY BUILT WHERE PEOPLE WANT THEM AS OPPOSED TO WHERE PEOPLE DO NOT WANT THEM. THEY WILL BE USED. AI ITSELF I THINK CREATES A LOT OF VALUE, SO I’M NOT REALLY WORRIED ABOUT IT, BUT YOU DO POINT OUT, THERE IS A LOT OF ADDITIONAL BORROWING. THE GOVERNMENT IS BORROWING TO TRILLION DOLLARS AGAIN, AND THIS IS A GLOBAL PHENOMENON, NOT JUST THE UNITED STATES, YET THERE IS A SUPPLY AND DEMAND OF CAPITAL. IF YOU THOUGHT THERE WAS A

18:53 SAVINGS GLUT YEARS AGO, AND OTHERS NOT. IT COULD BE A GOOD THING IF RATES ARE GOING UP AND CAPITAL USED PRODUCTIVELY. THE PROBLEM PART IS THE GOVERNMENT CONSUMPTION. THAT IS A WHOLE DIFFERENT THING. OF COURSE, GOVERNMENT SPENDING CAN DRIVE INFLATION, SO THEY CAN BE A FLIPSIDE OF HOW THIS PLAYS OUT. >> YOU MENTIONED THE POLITICS OF AI. >> THESE ARE DIFFERENT ISSUES. DATA CENTERS, BUILD THEM WHERE

19:24 THEY ARE WANTED. HALF THE NEW ONES IN AMERICA ARE IN TEXAS AND VIRGINIA, AND PEOPLE DO NOT WANT THEM THERE. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO WIN. OF COURSE, AND A BIG COMPANY HAS TO BE A GOOD COMMUNITY CITIZEN, SO I THINK A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE ARE DOING IT, GOING INTO TOWN AND BEING PART OF THE COMMUNITY TO HELP THE COMMUNITY GET THE RIGHTS. IT’S JUST THINGS LIKE THAT. THAT WILL BE WORKED THROUGH.

19:55 AI HAS THESE HUGE POSITIVE EFFECTS. I THINK IT WILL CURE A LOT OF DISEASES AND MAKE LIFE UNBELIEVABLE FOR PEOPLE. THE DOWNSIDE IS OBVIOUSLY, WHAT YOU READ ABOUT WITH THE AGENTS AND MYTHOS AND ALL THESE THINGS, AND THAT IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN, A REAL THING. I’M NOT GOING TO GET HYSTERICAL OVER IF IT IS EXISTENTIAL OR NOT. WHAT WE ARE DOING IS ROLLING UP OUR SLEEVES AND GOING TO WORK TO FIX IT. BANKS HAVE ALWAYS HAD A SYSTEM IN PLACE WHERE THEY HELP EACH OTHER.

20:30 IT IS STARTING WITH 50 COMPANIES, STARTING IN THE U.S., ACROSS SIX INDUSTRIES. TECH, FINANCIAL SERVICES, WATER, TRANSPORT. THESE INDUSTRIES THAT THE GOVERNMENT POINTS TO AS A LIFELINE, BUT IT SHOULD PROBABLY EXTEND TO HEALTH CARE, PHARMA, AGRICULTURAL. EVERY INDUSTRY IS KIND OF CRITICAL, AND WE NEED TO HELP SMALLER COMPANIES, TOO. IT IS A LOT OF WORK. WE SIMPLY HAVE TO DO IT. AI CREATED VULNERABILITIES WE DID NOT KNOW ABOUT.

21:02 >> YOU HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT CYBER RISKS FOR A LONG TIME. I KNOW THAT. DOES AI MAKE CYBER SYSTEMIC RISKS MORE LIKELY? >> YEAH. THAT’S WHAT I’M SAYING. MYTHOS, WHATEVER YOU THOUGHT IT WAS BEFORE – I SENT TO MY CHAIRMAN CYBER IS OUR BIGGEST RISK, AND THEY HAVE NOT PUBLISHED YET, AND I WOULD SAY THE THREAT WENT UP WHEN MYTHOS WAS PUBLISHED. MINMIN:

21:34 WE ARE, OF COURSE, LOOKING AT CHINESE MAINLAND MARKETS, STILL CLOSED FOR A FINAL DAY BEFORE REOPENING TOMORROW. FUTURES ARE POINTING HIGHER, BUT YOU LOOK AT THE HANG SENG, BIOTECH ALSO LEADING DECLINES, 1.8% LOWER, ERASING THE GAINS WE SAW YESTERDAY. NOT MUCH OF A CATALYST GOING ON FOR WHAT HAS BEEN A STANDOUT SECTOR SO FAR THIS YEAR. HSTECH ALSO DOWN .3%. PLENTY MORE AHEAD. THIS IS BLOOMBERG.

22:13 MINMIN: HONG KONG MARKETS ARE LOOKING LIKE THEY SPIRIT FUTURES POINTING DOWN BUT THEY HANG SENG DOWN BY .5%, NOT REALLY FEELING THE TAILWINDS FROM THE U.S. TECH RALLY. THE BIOTECH INDEX REALLY LEADING DECLINES. YVONNE: EVEN TECH STOCKS, DESPITE DEEPSEEK SOURCES SAYING THEY ARE PLANNING TO RAISE AT LEAST $20 MILLION IN THIS LATEST FUNDING ROUND, NOT ENOUGH TO REVIVE TECH TRADING TODAY. ONE BRIGHT SPOT IN PARTICULAR IS STILL THE OPTICAL STOCKS.

22:50 WE WILL HAVE THE OPEN COMING UP NEXT. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. AVON: WELCOME BACK. YOU ARE WATCHING “THE CHINA SHOW,” AND WE ARE COUNTING DOWN TO THE

23:21 OPEN MARKETS IN HONG KONG. FINALLY, THAT COOL BREEZE HAS RETURNED TO THE CITY. IT IS OCTOBER 7. WE ARE FINALLY GETTING TO FALL WEATHER. CERTAINLY THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS NICE ACROSS THESE MARKETS. NOT THE SAME SORT OF MONTH. A LOT OF PEOPLE COMPLAINING ABOUT LOW BREADTH WHEN IT COMES TO THE RALLIES WE ARE SEEING. PEOPLE MAY BE STILL QUESTIONING IF THIS IS A BUBBLE OR NOT RIGHT NOW.

23:52 >> – MINMIN: YEAH, IT HAS BEEN VERY U.S. DOMESTIC-DRIVEN. HANG SENG TECH TODAY IN PRE-MARKETS WERE ALREADY DOWN, AND TOMORROW IS A BIG DAY WITH MARKET REOPENING AND WE ARE ALSO SEEING HEADWINDS WHEN IT COMES TO THE EU AND CHINA AS WELL. THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT CALLING ON FRANCE AND GERMANY NOT TO CALL FOR PROTECTIONIST MEASURES AT EVERY TURN AS WE HEAD INTO TRADE TALKS TOMORROW. TAKING A LOOK AT HANG SENG, DOWN BY .2%. TECH IS NOT DOING A LOT HERE AS WELL.

24:25 NOT A LOT OF CATALYSTS FOR SOME OF THESE CHINESE TECH SHARES, EVEN DESPITE FUNDRAISING DEALS WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR. TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF THESE TECH STOCKS, ALL IN THE RED HERE. IT LOOKS LIKE THOSE FUNDRAISING TARGETS THAT HAVE BEEN EXCEEDED HAVE NOT BEEN ENOUGH TO INJECT MORE OPTIMISM INTO THE CHINESE AI PLAY HERE. TENCENT SET TO BE BACKING DEEPSEEK’S UNDERGROUND. WE ARE LOOKING AHEAD TO THOSE IPO’S AS WELL, AND WE ARE ALSO

24:57 CHECKING BIOTECH STOCKS IN CHINA. THIS HAS BEEN ONE OF THE BEST PERFORMING SECTORS OF THE YEAR SO FAR. IF YOU LOOK AT JEN SCRIPT, THAT IS DOWN BY 16% AND PERHAPS ADJUST NOT A LOT OF CATALYSTS GOING ON THIS WEEK, PARTICULARLY WITH MAINLAND CHINA CLOSED. PERHAPS SOME PROFIT TAKING, THOUGH THROUGHOUT THE YEAR, WE HAVE SEEN THIS BOUNTY OF OUTBOUND LICENSES FROM THESE CHINESE BIOTECH FIRMS THAT HAVE LIFTED THE SECTOR YEAR TODAY. TODAY A BIT OF A DOWN DAY FOR

25:28 THEM. YVONNE: IT HAS BEEN REALLY SURGING, THAT STOP, SO WE HAVE COME OFF OF THAT PRETTY SUBSTANTIALLY TODAY, BUT IT HAS STILL BEEN A PRETTY STELLAR STOP. JP MORGAN OUT WITH THIS CALL, SAYING WHEN IT COMES TO CHINESE INSURANCE COMPANY EARNINGS, THEY MAY DROP MORE THAN 50% FROM A YEAR AGO BECAUSE OF THE VOLATILITY WE SEE IN LOCAL MARKETS. THEY SAY MAYBE THE DECLINES IN THE STOCK COULD BE A BUYING OPPORTUNITY GIVEN TO, YES, ONCE AGAIN, THAT DIVIDEND PLAY. THIS WAS AN UPGRADE FROM JP

26:01 MORGAN AS WELL. THIS WAS THE HEAVY TRUCK COMPANY. THEY TALKED ABOUT WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR, THIS RECENT PULLBACK IN THE STOCK, MAINLY DRIVEN BY NEGATIVE SENTIMENT. WHEN IT COMES TO THE FUNDAMENTALS OF THIS COMPANY, THEY SAY STILL LOOKING PRETTY STRONG AND THAT’S WHY THEY’VE UPGRADED PRICE TARGETS THIS MORNING. MINMIN: TAIWAN’S BENCHMARK STOCK INDEX MEANWHILE HAS OVERTAKEN THE KOSPI AS THE WORLD’S BEST MAJOR PERFORMING EQUITY MARKETS THIS

26:36 YEAR, DESPITE BOTH BEING BENEFICIARIES OF THE AI TRADE. FOR MORE, WE ARE JOINED BY OUR ASIAN EQUITIES REPORTER. TELL US WHAT IS GOING ON IN THE KOREA AND TAIWAN MARKET. WHY ARE WE SEEING THESE INDICES SWITCH PLACES? >> AT HAS BEEN INTERESTING TO SEE HOW THE TOP-PERFORMING GLOBAL GAINS SWITCHED HANDS IN THE PAST FEW WEEKS. WE NOW HAVE TAIEX INDEX UP BY ABOUT 72% SO FAR THIS YEAR VERSUS KOREA, UP ABOUT 65%. THE QUARTERLY PERFORMANCE OF TAIWAN VERSUS KOREA WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW MUCH AND HAS BEEN

27:08 OUTPERFORMING IS ACTUALLY AT ITS BIGGEST SINCE THE YEAR 2000, AND BEING DRIVEN BY A COUPLE DIFFERENT FACTORS. FIRST, OF COURSE, INVESTORS ROTATING AWAY FROM KOREA. THEY ARE BEING BURNED OUT BECAUSE OF THE VOLATILITY. THEY BECOME MORE DISENGAGED, AND OF COURSE, THE CONCERNS WHEN IT COMES TO THE PEAK OF MEMORY PRICES, AND KOREA IS SO CONCENTRATED WITH THESE NAMES AND INVESTORS SEEKING OTHER OPPORTUNITIES AND FINDING NAMES RELATED TO THESE BOTTLENECKS.

27:41 IT IS ALSO SHOWING UP IN THE EARNINGS REVISION. WERE TALKING ABOUT AN UPGRADE WHEN IT COMES TO EARNINGS FOR TAIWAN, FIRST TIME OUTPACING THAT OF SOUTH KOREA ON A QUARTERLY BASIS SINCE MARCH LAST YEAR. THAT EARNINGS MOMENTUM AND DIVERGENCE DRIVING PERFORMANCES HERE. >> – YVONNE: WHAT MAKES TAIWAN UNIQUE, DO YOU THINK? >> IT IS INTERESTING BECAUSE IT’S SO DIVERSE AND IT COMES TO WHAT THEY CAN OFFER ALONG THE SUPPLY CHAIN, THE PICKS AND SHOVELS. THE OTHER DAY, WE HAD A BLOOMBERG REPORT ABOUT THE

28:16 BILLIONAIRES BEHIND THE AI TRADE. ONE OF IT BEING A FOUNDER OF A COMPANY THAT MAKES RAIL TRACKS FOR AI DATA CENTERS, AND THE STOCK IS UP ABOUT 250% SO FAR THIS YEAR, SO TAIWAN HAS A LOT OF THESE COMPANIES THAT MAKE THESE SMALL COMPONENTS, MATERIALS THAT ARE JUST INDISPENSABLE AND SO CRITICAL FOR THE AI TRADE. AND WHAT’S CHANGING IN THE BIGGER PICTURE IS THAT THE TREND HAS BEEN SHIFTING AWAY FROM THE CUSTOMER BEING JUST NVIDIA TO ALL THESE U.S.

28:49 HYPERSCALERS TRYING TO BUILD THEIR OWN ECOSYSTEM. YOU HAVE META. YOU HAVE GOOGLE. FOR THAT TO HAPPEN, YOU NEED EVERYTHING FROM CPU’S TWO COOLING SYSTEMS TO ALL THESE NETWORKING, FOR EXAMPLE, AND TAIWAN HAS ALL THESE NAMES, SO THAT’S KIND OF WHAT IS DRIVING ALL THE EXCITEMENT AROUND THE TAIWANESE NAMES. >> HOW MUCH MORE UPSIDE ARE WE LOOKING AT? >> OF COURSE THERE CAN BE A BIT OF A SLOWDOWN GIVEN HOW MUCH IT

29:20 HAS COME UP, BUT WE JUST HEARD FROM SOCGEN THE OTHER DAY SAYING THEY STILL PREFER TAIWAN AT THIS POINT OVER SOUTH KOREA, BUT IT’S ABOUT HOW YOU CAN BE MORE SPECIFIC, FOCUSING ON THE NAMES THAT ARE EXPOSED TO CORPORATE GOVERNANCE REFORM AND EVEN INDUSTRIALS, MATERIALS, WHILE FOR TAIWAN, THEY ARE LOOKING AT SOME OF THE NAMES THAT SEE SOME SECTORAL RE-RATING. REMEMBER THE OTHER DAYS THIS WEEK, WE HAD A NOTE FROM BANK OF AMERICA SAYING THERE’S MORE

29:51 UPSIDE WHEN IT COMES TO THE MATERIAL FOR THE CIRCUIT BOARDS, AND WE SEE THAT THE NAMES THEY RECOMMENDED, THREE OF THOSE NAMES JUMPING BY ABOUT 350% AS WELL SO FAR THIS YEAR. WHEN YOU SEE SALE SIDES BECOMING MORE OPTIMISTIC ABOUT THOSE SECTORS IN TAIWAN, THAT’S WHERE WE SEE FURTHER UPSIDE. YVONNE: WE ARE EXPECTING RECORD PROFITS. IS THIS ENOUGH TO REVIVE THE STOCK IN KOREA?

30:23 >> THAT IS VERY QUESTIONABLE. INVESTORS ARE NOT SURE ABOUT THAT RIGHT NOW BECAUSE WE SAW WHAT HAPPENED TO MICRON. SIMILAR MOVES. YOU REPORT OUTSTANDING RESULTS, BUT INVESTORS ARE NOT AS IMPRESSED WHEN IT COMES TO BETTING FURTHER ON THE STOCK. THIS TIME AROUND, WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS FOR THEM TO SEE THE DURABILITY OF THE EARNINGS GOING FORWARD, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE ARE SEEING MANY OF THE NOTES POINTING TO A SLOWDOWN IN THE APPRECIATION OF MEMORY PRICES

30:55 GOING FORWARD. IF SAMSUNG IS ABLE TO CONTINUE THAT MOMENTUM INTO NEXT YEAR AND INTO THE COMING QUARTERS WILL BE SOMETHING KEY TO WATCH, AND THEN THEIR BUYBACK PLANS IS ANOTHER THING TO WATCH AS THEY WRAP UP THEIR CURRENT BUYBACK PLAN. YVONNE: WE ARE KEEPING AN EYE OUT WHEN IT COMES TO OIL PRICES AFTER IRAN STEPPED UP ATTACKS IN THE STRAIT OF HORMUZ IN RECENT DAYS JUST AT A TIME AND ANALYSTS WERE STARTING TO SEE WHEN IT COMES TO FLOWS AROUND THESE KEY

31:28 AREAS, IT IS ACTUALLY CLIMBING BACK TOWARD PRE-WAR LEVELS AS WELL, BUT WHY IS OIL MARKETS STILL ABOUT $100? MINMIN: PERHAPS OVERSHADOWED BY THE INCREASED PACE OF VESSELS. CHINA’S INDEPENDENT OIL REFINERS ARE TURNING TO IRAQI CRUDE AS A U.S. BLOCKADE CHOKES OFF SUPPLIES FROM IRAN WHILE COMPETITION FROM STATE-OWNED RIVALS MAKES RUSSIAN OIL TOO EXPENSIVE. AT LEAST 50 TANKERS ARE BOTTLENECKED ALONG THE NATION’S

32:04 COAST. COULD YOU TELL US, WHAT DOES IT TELL US RIGHT NOW ABOUT THE LEVEL OF OIL AND INTRIGUED THAT CHINA HAS? >> RIGHT, SO WE DO UNDERSTAND THAT IT HAS BEEN WIDELY AGREED ON THAT CHINA IS STILL SITTING ON A VAST CUSHION OF OIL INVENTORIES, BUT THROUGHOUT THIS WAR, WE HAVE SEEN THAT THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN PRETTY JUDICIOUS WITH IT, AND WE HAVE NOT SEEN A HUGE DRAWDOWN ON A SIGNIFICANT LEVEL.

32:35 RIGHT NOW, CHINA IS SITTING ON OVER A BILLION BARRELS OF OIL, AND IT WOULD SEEM IT WOULD TAKE A FEW MORE HURDLES FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO TAP ON THIS IN A HUGE WAY, WHICH IS WHY WHEN WE LOOK AT THE SMALLER GROUPS OF, LIKE, THE CHINESE INDEPENDENT REFINERS, IN THE PAST COUPLE OF MONTHS, THEY ARE ESSENTIALLY BEING FORCED INTO THE SUPPLY SPACE, REASON BEING THAT THE CRUDE FEEDSTOCK AROUND THE WORLD, PRICES HAVE BEEN SKYROCKETING. THESE REFINERS WHICH HAVE TYPICALLY BEEN THE MOST PRICE-SENSITIVE OF GROUPS

33:07 WITHIN CHINA, THEY HAVE BEEN TENDING TO AN UNLIKELY ALTERNATIVE, WHICH IS IRAQI CRUDE, AND THAT’S ALSO A FUNCTION OF HOW THE OIL MARKET IS FUNCTIONING RIGHT NOW. WITH YOUR MIDDLE EASTERN MARKETERS AND SELLERS SUCH AS IRAQ PUTTING A LOT OF EFFORT INTO CHANNELING OIL OUT OF THE GULF AND MARKETING THEM TOWARD THE USUAL CUSTOMERS, RIGHT NOW IRAQI CRUDE IS ESSENTIALLY CHEAPER THAN THE OTHER ALTERNATIVES THAT THESE PRIMARY REFINERS ARE USED TO.

33:38 THIS INCLUDES RUSSIAN OIL WHICH CHINESE STATE-OWNED PLAYERS HAVE BEEN SWEEPING UP THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS. THESE HINT AT A SIGN OF HOW THE CHINESE ARE TREATING CRUDE PROCUREMENT AS A WHOLE DURING THIS CRISIS RATHER THAN TAPPING ON THE CONVENIENT VESSEL OF THEIR OIL INVENTORIES. YVONNE: HELP US UNDERSTAND A LITTLE BIT. YOU ARE HEARING REPORTS WHEN IT COMES TO OIL AND GAS FLOWS ARE LOOKING PRETTY STEADY. THAT HAS PICKED UP SINCE THE START OF THE SUMMER. WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE STILL

34:09 HOVERING AROUND $100 OIL RIGHT NOW? >> MIKE, SO LET’S EXPLAIN THE FIRST PART OF THE QUESTION WHICH IS WHY OIL IS STILL CONTINUOUSLY COMING UP. MIDDLE EASTERN PRODUCERS IN THE PAST COUPLE OF MONTHS HAVE ADJUSTED TO THE NEW NORMAL. IT HAS BEEN THE NORM FOR THEM. OF COURSE, IF YOU LOOK AT OTHER SUPPLIES OF OIL, FOR INSTANCE,

34:42 FOR CHINA, WHO USED TO BE LARGELY RELIANT ON A RAINY AND CRUDE, ALL THESE MILLIONS OF BARRELS OF OIL HAVE BEEN LEFT UP BEHIND THE U.S. NAVAL BLOCKADE, SO THERE IS A HUGE GAP THAT THEY HAVE TO FILL, AND THESE REFINERS, LIKE I MENTIONED EARLIER, HAD BEEN COMING BACK IN FORCE TO PURCHASE MAINSTREAM CRUDE GRADES, LIKE IRAQI CRUDE WHICH USED TO BE AVAILABLE FOR THE WIDER MARKET. EVEN THOUGH OIL IS STILL FLOWING OUT OF THE STRAIT OF HORMUZ, ESSENTIALLY, THE AVAILABLE SUPPLIES HAVE KIND OF

35:14 SHRUNK, AND THERE ARE MORE PURCHASES PILING IN ON THE SAME FEW GRADES BECAUSE THE OTHER AVAILABLE CRUDE GRADES HAVE EFFECTIVELY BEEN BLOCKED BY THE U.S. NAVAL BLOCKADE, WHICH REINSTATED IN JULY. YVONNE: THANK YOU. COMING UP, WE WANT TO HEAD BACK TO SINGAPORE. WE WILL BE JOINED BY CRYPTO VENTURE FUND DRAGONFLY AS BITCOIN HOLDS ABOVE 1000 BUCKS. MORE NEXT. THIS IS BLOOMBERG.

36:00 YVONNE: OF COURSE, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT TOKEN 2049, A GOOD CHANCE TO LOOK BACK ON THE QUARTER WHEN IT COMES TO BITCOIN PRICES. IT ACTUALLY STOOD OUT TO BE QUITE A STANDOUT IF YOU LOOK AT THIS REBOUND WE SAW IN THE THIRD QUARTER. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT SOME 40% GAINS, BASICALLY THE HIGHEST QUARTERLY GAIN WE HAVE SEEN SINCE, OF COURSE, GET THIS – THAT U.S. PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION OUTCOME WHEN TRUMP SECURED HIS SECOND TERM. CERTAINLY THIS CRYPTO-FRIENDLY PRESIDENT, THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF ANTICIPATION THAT HE WAS

36:34 GOING TO REALLY HELP THE WHOLE DIGITAL ASSETS SORT OF GAME, BUT, YES, WE HAVE SEEN A BIT OF A RALLY, BUT THEN AGAIN, WE ARE NOT FAR FROM THE PEAKS WE SAW, THAT SLUMP WE SAW THAT STARTED MAY BE THE END OF OCTOBER LAST YEAR. WE WERE 126,000 AT ONE POINT. AT ONE POINT WE DROPPED TO 50-SOMETHING THOUSAND. IT SEEMS LIKE WE KEEP HITTING OUR HEAD ACROSS THE CEILING OF $87,000. AS YOU TALK ABOUT TREASURY YIELDS, THAT IS WEIGHING WHEN

37:07 IT COMES TO THESE SPECULATIVE ASSETS AS WELL, BUT IT BRINGS THE QUESTION ON WHAT IS THE NEXT BET WHEN IT COMES TO THE CRYPTO WORLD? MINMIN: NOT REALLY HITTING THE LEVELS OF EUPHORIA WE SAW LAST YEAR. “INSIDE” ANGER HASLINDA AMIN IS STANDING BY WITH OUR NEXT GUEST “INSIGHT – “INSIGHT” ANCHOR HASLINDA AMIN.

37:44 HASLINDA: GOOD TO HAVE YOU WITH US. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE ONE MILLION? >> I DON’T KNOW WHO IS SAYING THAT. I THINK IT’S CLEAR THAT WAS AN OUTLANDISH POSITION. NOW THAT SOME OF THE CRAZINESS HAS DRAINED OUT OF THE AD MARKET – IF YOU REMEMBER EARLIER THIS YEAR, GOLD WAS GOING CRAZY. THEN YOU HAD MEMORY STOCKS GOING CRAZY. NOW I THINK RETAIL ATTENTION IS STARTING TO PICK UP AGAIN. WE ARE SEEING RETAIL SIGNS OF INTEREST. SOME OF THE APPS IN

38:17 THE APP STORE GETTING INTEREST. THESE ARE SOME CONVENTIONAL SIGNS OF RETAIL PAYING ATTENTION TO CRYPTO AGAIN. PEOPLE KIND OF FORGOT THE INDUSTRY EVEN EXISTED. RETAIL IS CYCLICAL, AND THE TIME IT’S NOT HERE, IT IS ON INSTITUTIONS AND HEDGE FUNDS TO KEEP UP DEMAND AND BE THE LAST BUYER OF RESORT FOR ASSET PRICES. HASLINDA: A RETAIL MAY BE RETURNING, BUT CAPITAL IS GOING TO AI. NOT LONG AGO, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT POSSIBLY THE EXTINCTION

38:49 OF CRYPTO VENTURE CAPITAL. IS IT GETTING EXTINCT? >> NO, I THINK IT IS EVOLVING. IF YOU REWIND THE CLOCK BACK TO 2021, 2022, THERE WERE A LOT MORE VC’S WHO RAISE THE MONEY THAT THEY WERE GOING TO DEPLOY INTO CRYPTO VENTURE. WHAT WE SAW WAS THAT MOST VC’S REALLY HAD NO BUSINESS MANAGING CAPITAL. THE IDEA WAS THAT ANYBODY COULD DO THIS. YOU JUST HAVE TO SLING SOME MONEY AROUND AND EVERYTHING

39:20 GOES UP AUTOMATICALLY, AND WE ARE IN A VERY DIFFERENT WORLD NOW. WE ARE IN A REGIME WHERE THERE’S NOT THAT MANY PLAYERS THAT ARE REALLY INSTITUTIONAL QUALITY THAT CAN REALLY ADD VALUE TO THESE PROJECTS. MOST OF THE EASY MONEY IN CRYPTO IS GONE NOW. THAT SAID, THERE ARE AMAZING BUSINESSES IN THIS INDUSTRY, SO THERE ARE THINGS LIKE POLYMARKET , COMPANIES LIKE RAND WHICH ARE GROWING STABLECOINS. THESE COMPANIES ARE GROWING AT RATES SIMILAR TO WHAT YOU SEE IN THE AD INDUSTRY. HASLINDA:

39:52 THEY MAY BE GROWING, BUT CAPITAL IS GOING THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION. WHAT WOULD IT TAKE? >> I THINK THE REALITY IS THAT IT IS A BIG WORLD. A LOT OF THE BIGGEST INSTITUTIONAL INVESTORS IN THE WORLD ARE STILL INVESTING IN SOME OF THESE COMPANIES. THEY HAVE HAD THE LIKES OF IF IT IS JP MORGAN OR WE HAD ICONIC AS AN INVESTOR INTO RAIN. THESE ARE VERY LARGE POOLS OF CAPITAL, SELF LARGE POOLS OF CAPITAL ARE STILL HERE, AND

40:23 THEN YOU HAVE PUBLIC COMPANIES AND DAT’S LIKE MICROSTRATEGY. THEY ARE STILL TAKING WALL STREET CAPITAL. HASLINDA: I WANT TO PUT IT OUT THERE THAT YOU HAVE BEEN A PACKET OF POLYMARKET BEFORE IT WAS A THING. LET’S TALK ABOUT THE PREDICTION MARKET. WE ARE TALKING WHAT? $200 BILLION IN PRODUCTION MARKETS RIGHT NOW? THE TARGET’S $1 TRILLION. IS THAT REALISTIC? >> I THINK IT’S CLEAR THAT IF YOU LOOK AT QUARTER OVER

40:54 QUARTER GROWTH, THESE THINGS ARE GROWING UP MASSIVE RATES, AND IT’S CLEAR THE MARKET IS NOT SATURATED. BOTH POLYMARKET AND KALSHI HAVE BEEN IN THE U.S. MARKET, BUT THE CONCEPT IS GLOBAL. PEOPLE ARE WANTING TO BET ON THE MOST IMPORTANT QUESTIONS OF THE DAY, AND ALSO USING THE INFORMATION THAT IS COMING OUT OF PREDICTION MARKETS TO MAKE OTHER DECISIONS. THAT PRODUCT IS A GLOBAL PRODUCT. EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD THAT IS LOOKING AT PREDICTION MARKET UNDERSTANDS WHAT IS HAPPENING WITH INTEREST RATES, WITH

41:30 RESPECT TO THE AI CAPEX BUILD OUT, WITH RESPECT TO THE WAR IN IRAN. ALL THESE QUESTIONS NOW HAVE BECOME NO LIGHTS OR PEOPLE, THAT IF I WANT TO KNOW SOMETHING, I DON’T JUST LOOK AT THE NEWS OR TALKING HEADS ON SCREENS. OBVIOUSLY, SHOWS LIKE THIS HAVE THEIR VALUE. >> I TAKE NO OFFENSE. >> BUT IT IS A MUCH MORE QUANTITATIVE INPUT. WE TALKED ALL THE TIME ABOUT THESE LARGE HEDGE FUNDS AND MARKET MAKERS, THEY USE POLYMARKET AND KALSHI AS INPUT INTO HOW THEY MAKE THEIR DECISIONS. THEY COULD HAVE THEIR OWN INDEPENDENT FORECAST, BUT WHAT

42:00 I MARKET TELLS THEM THEY WILL ALWAYS FIND MORE TRUSTWORTHY. HASLINDA: YET, AT THE SAME TIME, IT IS SEEING LOTS OF LAWSUITS. >> THESE LAWSUITS ARE MOSTLY THE STATES IN THE U.S. SUING AGAINST THESE PREDICTION MARKETS SAYING THAT YOU ARE SAYING YOU ARE JUST FEDERALLY REGULATED AND YOU DO NOT NEED TO GET LICENSES IN THE STATES. WE DISAGREE. UNSURPRISINGLY, IF THEY HAVE TO GET STATE-BY-STATE LICENSES, THEY HAVE TO PAY STATE TAXES. THIS IS A FIGHT ABOUT TAXATION, NOT A FIGHT ABOUT IT BUT ACTION MARKETS HAVE A RIGHT TO EXIST.

42:30 IF THEY HAVE TO GET THESE STATE-BY-STATE GAMBLING LICENSES TO OFFER SPORTS IN THESE DIFFERENT STATES, THAT IS LEGAL. YOU JUST HAVE TO GET A LICENSE AND PAY TAXES. THIS WILL PROBABLY END UP GOING TO THE SUPREME COURT. MY GUESS IS NEXT YEAR, AND THIS WILL BE A BIG FIGHT, BUT AT THE END, THESE BUSINESSES WILL EXIST. HASLINDA: IT WILL EXIST AND THERE WILL BE GROWTH, AND THERE WILL BE COPYCATS. YOU SAY 90% OF THEM WILL FAIL. WHY? >> MOST LIKELY. THE REALITY IS THAT RIGHT NOW

43:03 EVERYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT POLYMARKET AND KALSHI. THEY HAVE THIS KIND OF RIZZ, AS THE KIDS CALL IT. HASLINDA: WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? >> IT MEANS THESE BRANDS RELATIVE TO THE OLD BRANDS, THEY CONNECT MORE WITH CONSUMERS. THEY ARE YOUNGER, THEY ARE COOLER. THEY HAVE THESE CELEBRITY ENDORSEMENTS. POLYMARKET ITSELF HAS BEEN – HAS BECOME TALKING ABOUT KLEENEX OR I WILL GOOGLE IT, IT’S ONE OF THESE THINGS THAT

43:35 HAS BECOME A VERB. ALL THESE DIFFERENT COMPANIES WILL LAUNCH THEIR OWN PRODUCTION MARKETS, BUT I DON’T THINK THEY WILL GET THE TRACTION YOU WILL SEE IN POLYMARKET. THERE MIGHT BE A CME MARKET ON THIS OR THAT, BUT MOST PEOPLE, MOST CONSUMERS, MOST INSTITUTIONS WILL THINK TO THEMSELVES, POLYMARKET IS WHERE I WILL GO. HASLINDA: I’M GOING TO GET YOU TO LOOK INTO THE CRYSTAL BALL BECAUSE YOU WERE RIGHT HEADING ON POLYMARKET. WHAT IS NEXT? >> I THINK A LOT MORE WILL HAPPEN ON THE INSTITUTIONAL

44:07 SIDE. TODAY, THESE ARE MOSTLY CONSUMER BRANDS. IT IS MOSTLY RETAIL COMING IN, AND INSTITUTIONS ARE PLAYING SOMEWHAT BUT MOSTLY PROVIDING LIQUIDITY. I THINK MORE AND MORE INSTITUTIONS ARE GOING TO PROVIDE WAYS TO HEDGE OUT SOME OF THOSE IDIOSYNCRATIC RISKS THEY HAVE IN THEIR OWN MARKETS. TODAY, THERE’S NOT THAT MUCH HEDGING ACTIVITY GOING ON.

44:38 THAT’S GOING TO CHANGE VERY SOON. HASLINDA: WE HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE. BY THE WAY, I FEEL SO OVERDRESSED COMPARED TO YOU. IF YOU DID NOT KNOW, HE WAS A FORMER PRO POKER PLAYER TURNED VENTURE CAPITALIST. MINMIN: WOW, THANK YOU SO MUCH. TAKE A LOOK AT HOW MARKETS ARE DOING RIGHT NOW.

45:10 THE NIKKEI AND KOSPI ARE BOTH SEEING DOWNSIDE HERE. TAIPEI TAIEX JUST KEEPING ITS HEAD ABOVE WATER RIGHT NOW. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. YVONNE: BENCHMARKS ARE DOING THIS IN HONG KONG. WE ARE SEEING A BIT OF A PULLBACK WHEN IT COMES TO HONG KONG, HSTECH MEETING. SEEMS LIKE WE ARE BEING DRAGGED DOWN BY 4%, LED BY THE LIKES OF

45:43 JEN SCRIPT, DOWN 15% RIGHT NOW. THAT DRUG OPTIMISM WHEN IT COMES TO AI, THAT SEEMS TO BE SEEING A BIT OF A PAUSE THIS MORNING. A LOT MORE IN THE NEXT HOUR. YOU ARE WATCHING “THE CHINA SHOW.” MINMIN: WELCOME BACK TO THE CHINA SHOW.

46:17 HERE’S A LOOK AT THE HSI I HALF-HOUR INTO THE SESSION. HANG SENG IS NOT DOWN BY HALF A PERCENT HERE. NOT MUCH IN THE WAY OF CATALYSTS DRIVING MARKETS TODAY. YOU ADD TO THAT SOME HEADWINDS WHEN IT COMES TO CHINA EU RELATIONS. THE HANG SENG TECH IS DOWN BY 1%. NOT FEELING THE TAILWINDS THAT ARE COMING FROM THE TECH RALLY IN THE U.S.. THAT’S NOT REALLY FEEDING THROUGH INTO ASIA. BIOTECH IS LEADING LOSSES TODAY. DOWN BY 3.5% TODAY.

46:50 YVONNE: WHEN THERE’S NOT MUCH NEWS TRIGGERING THE SELLOFF, PERHAPS IT IS PROFIT TAKING, HOW MUCH THE SECTOR HAS REALLY STOOD OUT WHEN IT COMES TO BIOTECH AND PHARMA. CERTAINLY A BIT OF A BREATHER TODAY. INTERESTING THAT THE HANG SENG RALLY WAS 1% YESTERDAY. WE ARE NOT SEEING THAT MUCH MOMENTUM BEHIND THIS WHOLE AI TRADE IN CHINA. LOOK AT SOME OF THE HSTECH LOSERS RIGHT NOW. ONCE AGAIN, THE BIG AI PLAYERS. EVEN WHEN IT COMES TO LENOVO.

47:21 MUCH BIGGER MOVES TO THE DOWNSIDE WHEN IT COMES TO MINIMAX, Z AI DESPITE WHAT OUR BLOOMBERG SOURCES HAVE BEEN REPORTING WHEN IT COMES TO DEEPSEEK AND THE LATEST FUNDING ROUND WHICH WAS QUITE SUCCESSFUL AHEAD OF THE PLANNED IPO. SO WHERE IS THE CONVICTION? STILL WE ARE WATCHING VERY CLOSELY HOW THESE ASIAN MENTION – BENCHMARKS ARE STILL KNOWN – NEAR RECORDS WHEN IT COMES TO THE NASDAQ. S&P HAD ITS WORST RECORD SINCE AUGUST BUT WE ARE NOT SEEING

47:52 THAT EXCEPT FOR TAIWAN. STILL. TAKING STOCK TODAY SHOWED INVESTOR PREFERENCE LINES IN TAPE PAY – TAIPEI, GIVEN THE DIVERSITY. IN – INDONESIAN ASSETS. WE WILL SEE IF THERE IS ANY MARKET REACTION OVERNIGHT THERE. THEY REITERATED THE EMERGING-MARKET STATUS ON THE BACK. AVOIDING THE DOWNGRADE THAT WAS THE CONCERN FROM THE MARKET THERE. WHAT COMES NEXT IS THE MSCI REVIEW NEXT MONTH. MINMIN:

48:22 SO WE ARE SEEING THE INDONESIAN BENCHMARKS – BENCHMARKS SLIGHTLY HIGHER TODAY. MEANWHILE, TECH HAS BEEN TAKING A BACKSEAT TODAY AND MARKETS. INDUSTRIALS ARE RALLYING, DENTING THE STENCH – BENCHMARK AND CAUSING DISPERSION. ANTHONY? >> IT’S BEEN AN INTERESTING SESSION. WE’VE SEEN SOME GOOD NEWS IN TECH BEING SOLD VERY HARD. THAT FOLLOWS ON FROM THE U.S. SESSION WHERE WE DID SEE SEMICONDUCTORS PULLBACK TO MAKE

48:54 WAY FOR A DOMESTIC AI STORY AROUND POWER AND ENERGY AND HYPERSCALERS. THAT DOESN’T HELP ASIA. REALLY BIG MOVES ON NAMES THAT HAD PRETTY DECENT NUMBERS. TAIWAN SLID DOWN. THAT STANDS OUT AGAINST A FLAT MARKET. DISCO IN JAPAN DOWN 7.1%. THAT STANDS OUT AGAINST A RELATIVELY FLAT MARKET. REPORTING DECENT NUMBERS IS NOT A GOOD ANYMORE. PEOPLE ARE TAKING MONEY OFF THE TABLE NOW THAT THEY HAVE SOME PROOF. WE CONTINUE TO SEE DOWNSIDE IN THE MEMORY SPACE. LG ELECTRONICS ALSO SELLING OFF.

49:28 SOME OF ITS CONTRACT WINDS ARE OUT-OF-THE-WAY. YOU CAN SEE WHO IS BENEFITING. IT’S NOT A VERY BIG PART OF ASIAN INDICES ANYMORE. THE INDUSTRIALS SPACE IS BACK IN A BIG WAY. WE HAVE THE HEAVY INDUSTRIALS MOVING IN BOTH KOREA AND JAPAN. FINALLY WE HAVE THE NUCLEAR COMPONENT OF THE CHINESE MARKET DEMONSTRATING WELL AFTER THE NUCLEAR RALLY IN THE U.S.. THAT IS COALESCING AS A THEME ACROSS THE AI ECOSYSTEM, THAT AI WILL BE POWERED INCREASINGLY WITH NUCLEAR DEPLOYMENT WHICH IS GETTING CHEAP BEER –

49:59 CHEAPER AND EASIER TO DO. THIS DOWNED OUT UNDERPERFORMER FOLLOWING OFF A WEEK SESSION IN THE U.S.. S&P ON FRIDAY. THERE’S A LOT OF VOLATILITY INTO THAT NEWS. THERE’S ALSO A LOT OF BACK-AND-FORTH AROUND THE SITUATION IN RUSSIA. THAT’S IMPACTING A LOT OF PHARMACEUTICAL SENTIMENT. TO SEE SOME MASSIVE MOVES ON THE AI INNOVATORS IN CHINA. DOUBLE FIGURE MOVES. NOT MUCH CORPORATE NEWS ALL DAY.

50:30 IT’S REALLY A REPRICING OF HOW MUCH INNOVATION WILL BE ALLOWED IN THE PHARMACEUTICAL SECTOR USING AI WITH THE PANDEMIC CONCERNS AROUND IN THE WORLD. MINMIN: THANK YOU. THAT WAS OUR BLOOMBERG MARKETS REPORTER ANTHONY STEPHENS. LET’S BRING IN DAVID SAVAGE. WE WERE JUST LOOKING AT SOME OF THE HEAVY LOSSES IN TECH NAMES AND A CHEF. WHY ARE WE SEEING SUCH A DISCONNECT BETWEEN THE U.S. TECH SECTOR AND WHAT’S HAPPENING HERE? >> ANTHONY COVERED IT WELL. WE HAVE HAD SOME GOOD NEWS EVEN TODAY. YOU ARE SEEING A BIT OF PROFIT-TAKING ON THAT.

51:08 IN FACT, SOME OF THE U.S. TECH LEADS FOR ASIA IN PARTICULAR WANT AS FAVORABLE. U.S. MEMORY STOCKS DID SELLOFF OVERNIGHT. THAT TRANSLATED INTO SOME – A WEAKER OPEN FOR THE KOSPI AS WELL. THE BROADER TREND IS PRETTY FAVORABLE FOR ASIA. THE TREND IN THE U.S. IS A BROADENING OF THE TECH RALLY, THE CHIP RALLY AND A NARROWING OF THE NEXT GAME. IF WE TAKE THE STOCKS INDEX, 100% TRADING OVER THEIR 50 DAY MOVING AVERAGE. ONLY 30% FOR THE BROADER S&P

51:39 AND EVEN LESS FOR U.S. SMALL CAPS. WE ARE SEEING MARKETS ARE ASSIGNING PREMIUM TO THESE FASTER GROWING, HIGHER-MARGIN BUSINESSES AND ASIA, PARTICULARLY JAPAN AND SOUTH KOREA, THOSE MARKETS STAND TO GAIN IF THE TREND CONTINUES. YVONNE: THE BANK OF AMERICA REPORT AROUND THESE BUBBLELIKE CHARACTERISTICS. THEY ARE SEEING IT WHEN IT COMES TO OIL AND HEALTH CARE. AND KOREA AS WELL. THEY SAY LOW BREATH IS BASICALLY LIKE THE INITIAL

52:14 CATALYST FOR THINGS BEING IN A BUBBLE. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT? SHOULD WE WORRY ABOUT CONCENTRATION OF RISK ONCE AGAIN? >> I THINK SO. IT TELLS YOU WHERE RISK MIGHT BE BUT IT’S NOT GOING TO BE THE CATALYST. I DON’T THINK BREADTH WILL BE SUFFICIENTLY NARROW TO THE POINT WHERE THE TRADE BREAKS. OVERNIGHT, UTILITY STOCKS WHICH HAVE BEEN REALLY WEAK IN THE U.S. WHERE THE BEST PERFORMING SECTOR. THE RELIEF WAS MAINLY BECAUSE

52:48 WE SAW THE DEAL BETWEEN GOOGLE PARENT AND CONSTELLATION ENERGY. AGAIN, EVEN THERE, THE TRADE IS STILL BASED ON THIS AI MOMENTUM. IT’S THE REALITY THAT MARKETS ARE DEALING WITH. CERTAINLY WHETHER WE LOOK AT SECTOR RETURNS OR FACTOR RETURNS, ALL ROADS LEAD TO THE AI TRADE. YVONNE: DAVID SAVAGE, THANK YOU. DEEPSEEK IS CLOSE TO SECURING AT LEAST $12 BILLION IN ITS LATEST FUNDING ROUND. REALLY, IT WAS SURPASSING WHAT

53:21 THE COMPANY ITSELF HAD EXPECTED, GIVEN THE INSATIABLE DEMAND THERE HAS BEEN. KEY BACKERS. CATL, TENCENT, THE LIKE AHEAD OF THE NEXT YEAR. THE CEO HAS THOUGHTS OF THIS. THERE’S A SHIFT WITHIN THE COMPANY THAT WAS AVERSE WHEN IT CAME TO EXTERNAL FINANCING BUT NOW IT SEEMS THEY ARE LEANING INTO IT. WHAT YOU MAKE OF THAT? >> IN THE EARLY DAYS OF DEEPSEEK , POST INCEPTION, IT WAS SET UP ON ALTRUISTIC MOTIVES.

53:57 FAMOUSLY, THE CEO WAS QUOTED AS SAYING THERE WERE THREE KNOWS FOR THE COMPANY. NO TO AN IPO, NO TO EXTERNAL FINANCING, AND THEY ARE THERE TO HELP PROLIFERATE TECHNOLOGY WITHIN THE DOMESTIC MARKET IN CHINA IN LINE WITH THE GOVERNMENT’S STRATEGY AND POLICY . COMMERCIALIZATION WAS THE THIRD NO. IT WASN’T SOMETHING THEY WERE SEEKING. THEY WERE A NONPROFIT SEEKING COMPANY. I THINK REALITY IS BITTEN. THE COST OF DEVELOPING AI IS EXTREMELY HIGH, AS WE’VE SEEN. NOT JUST FROM THE SIDE BUT THE

54:33 ONGOING ENERGY RELATED COSTS FROM AI USE. DEEPSEEK AND ITS FOUNDER TO HAVE A PROFITABLE HEDGE FUND BEHIND THEM. AGAIN, THEY’VE HAD TO COME TO THE EXTERNAL MARKET AND SEEK FINANCING. ONE OTHER SUBSIDIARY POINT. IT WAS REPORTED THAT THEY HAD LOST A NUMBER OF ENGINEERS OVER THE LAST YEAR. SOME INCREDIBLY COMPETITIVE MARKET FOR TALENT. THEREFORE YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT YOUR STUFF – STAFF ARE WELL PAID AND REPORTED WITH STOCK OPTIONS. GOING DOWN THE IPL ROUTE – IPO ROUTE IS ANOTHER REASON FOR

55:05 DOING THAT. YOU CAN PUT AN EXTERNAL VALUATION ON THE COMPANY. MINMIN: GIVEN THAT THEY ARE TAKING EXTERNAL FINANCING NOW, HOW ARE THEY GOING TO BALANCE THE CONFLICT OF INTEREST BETWEEN KEEPING SHAREHOLDERS AND THE COMPANY HAPPY? COMMERCIALIZATION IS THE LAST GOAL. >> THAT’S AN EXCELLENT QUESTION. THE FOUNDER IS REALLY A TECH GUY. HE’S AN INJURY GOT – A DEVELOPER THROUGH AND THROUGH. NOT ONLY THE LEADING AI MODEL COMPANY WITHIN CHINA BUT ON A

55:37 GLOBAL BASIS. EVEN TWO DAYS AGO, WE WERE TALKING A HERE – HERE ABOUT CHINA NARROWING THE PERFORMANCE GAP TO A RECORD LOW OF 3% LEAD BY DEEPSEEK. THEIR PRIMARY FOCUS REMAINS ON TECHNOLOGY TO SUPPORT THE NATIONAL STRATEGY TO PROLIFERATE THE TECHNOLOGY WITHIN CHINA, WITHIN EVERY PROVINCE, WITHIN EVERY INDUSTRY. FROM AN ECONOMIC STANDPOINT, IT’S GREAT. THEN THEY HAVE TO MARRY THAT WITH PROFIT-SEEKING MOTIVES.

56:08 SHAREHOLDERS WANT TO RETURN AT THE END OF THE DAY. IT’S A DIFFICULT BALANCING ACT I THINK. A FINE LINE THAT THEY WILL HAVE TO TREAD. YVONNE: OK. THE IPO. EVERYONE HAS BEEN ANTICIPATING THIS ONE. DO YOU FORESEE A LOT OF INVESTOR INTEREST? >> THERE HAS TO BE. AS YOU SAID IN YOUR PRELUDE, THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THEY RAISED EXCEEDED EXPECTATIONS. THEY ARE THE LEADING PLAYER IN CHINA AI.

56:39 DOMESTICALLY, IF YOU PUT ME – YOUR MONEY IN ONE NAME, THAT’S GREAT. HOWEVER, LET’S JUST LOOK AT OUR FRIENDS AT MINIMAX. IPO’D IN THE HONG KONG MARKET IN JANUARY AND THE STOCK PRICE WENT UP NINE TIMES. THESE WERE FANTASTICALLY PERFORMING STOCKS, HOW YOU SOLD IN MAY OR JUNE. SINCE THEN, THE STOCK PRICE IS DOWN CLOSE TO 70%. I THINK ONE HUGE THING THEY NEED TO FOCUS ON IS BUILDING UP A HIGH-QUALITY INSTITUTIONAL

57:11 SHAREHOLDER BASE. AS WE APPRECIATE IN THIS PART OF A SHARK, THERE’S A LOT OF RETAIL INVESTOR INTEREST. NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. RETAIL INVESTORS TEND TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE FICKLE THAN THEIR INSTITUTIONAL COUNTERPARTS. MINMIN: THANK YOU SO MUCH. THAT WAS ROBERT LEA. STILL AHEAD, PHYSICAL AI AND EXTENDED REALITY TECHNOLOGY. SMART GLASSES. THIS IS THE CEO OF SAMSUNG – OF VITA. THIS IS BLOOMBERG.

58:03 YVONNE: MORE NOW FROM THE MILKEN INSTITUTE IN SINGAPORE. SMART CLASSES. OUR NEXT GUEST MAKES EXTENDED REALITY AND AUGMENTED REALITY SMART GLASSES. THEY’VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT HOW BIG THE MARKET REALLY CAN BE. FOURTH AMONG THE WORLD HERE. THEY FOLLOW THE LIKES OF RAY-BAN AND META-. THAT WAS THE ONE THAT THEY DOMINATE IN THIS SPACE AS WELL. XIAOMI IS IN THE TOP AS WELL. 2.5%.

58:39 IN A MARKET THAT IS VERY EXCITING, ENTICING OR GET ALSO RAISING PRIVACY CONCERNS. MINMIN: A LOT OF ATTENTION FROM POLICYMAKERS. I’VE BEEN READING ABOUT HOW THE STUDENTS USE THESE GLASSES. YVONNE: CAN YOU IMAGINE HAVING THOSE WHEN YOU WERE IN SCHOOL? MINMIN: YOU CAN UPLOAD PDFS OF YOUR PAPER INTO YOUR SMART CLASSES. BUT YES. AVRIL HONG JOINS US FROM THE MILKEN SUMMIT. AVRIL: YEAH. SMART GLASSES IN SCHOOL WOULD’VE BEEN A GAME CHANGER.

59:13 WITH ME NOW, THE CEO. GREAT TO HAVE YOU WITH US. SO TALK TO US ABOUT THIS INDUSTRY. WE ARE SEEING EXPONENTIAL GROWTH IN THE PAST YEAR. IS IT MAINSTREAM THOUGH YET? SMART GLASSES ADOPTION. >> ACTUALLY NOT YET. LOOK AROUND. SEE ALL THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU WHO ARE WEARING SMART CLASSES. STILL A LOT OF VERY LOW PENETRATION RATE. BUT WE ARE GETTING THERE. I THINK THE TREND IS THAT WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE WAY HOW WE COMMUNICATE WITH COMPUTERS. AND THEN THE PEOPLE ARE GOING

59:49 TO HAVE MORE DEMAND FOR THE NEW PRODUCT THAT GETS TO COMMUNICATE WITH THAT IS BETTER THAN PHONE. PEOPLE ALREADY GET IT THROUGH THE PHONE. BUT A PHONE IS A CONTAINER OF ALL THE GAPS. NOWADAYS, PEOPLE STILL INTERACT WITH ALL THE GAPS. THERE’S A BIG TREND RIGHT NOW THAT PEOPLE MORE AND MORE YOU SAY I A LOT. – USE AI A LOT. THIS MONTH, MORE AND MORE PERSONAL AI AGENTS COMING OUT. AVRIL: DO YOUR SMART GLASSES ALREADY

1:00:20 LINK UP WITH AI AGENTS? >> I’M WEARING THE SMART GLASSES . IT LOOKS LIKE NORMAL GLASSES BUT I CAN GET A NEW BIRTH, I CAN BOOK TICKETS, I CAN BOOK HOTELS, I CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT. YOU CAN REPLY TO EMAIL ON THAT AS WELL. AVRIL: WHAT AI AGENTS ARE YOU LINKED UP TO? >> RIGHT NOW, THERE ARE THREE. OPENAI, ANTHROPIC CLOUD, AND GOOGLE GEMINI. AVRIL: NOT THE CHINESE ONES?

1:00:51 >> OUR MARKET IS EUROPE AND U.S.. AVRIL: WHAT ABOUT WHEN IT COMES TO THE MARKET FOR YOU NOW? IT’S PARTICULARLY GEARED TOWARDS GAMING AND ENTERTAINMENT. BUT WITH THIS PARTICULAR PRODUCT, IT’S MORE ABOUT EVERYDAY APPLICATIONS. HOW ARE YOU EXPANDING PRODUCT OFFERINGS? >> WE STARTED IN 2021. BACK THEN, THERE WAS NO WAY I. WE FOCUSED ON AR GLASSES OR X ARE GLASSES WHICH CREATED AN

1:01:22 IMMERSIVE EXPERIENCE FOR YOU ON THE GO. YOU CAN WEAR THE GLASSES ON AN AIRPLANE OR IN A COFFEE SHOP TO PLAY GAMES AND TO WATCH VIDEOS, NETFLIX. OR FOR PRODUCTIVITY USE CASES. STARTING FROM 2022, OUR REVENUE DOUBLED EVERY YEAR. WE ARE THE LEADING BRAND RIGHT NOW IN THE WORLD IN THAT SECTOR. WHICH IS A SECTOR, THE AR GLASSES WITH THE DISPLAY. THIS IS THE SECOND PLAY.

1:01:57 WITHOUT THIS PLAY, IT’S LIKE A NEW MARKET AFTER AI GOT REALLY POPULAR. AVRIL: THEY ARE STILL THE DOMINANT PLAYER, RIGHT? >> OF COURSE. A LOT OF PEOPLE PURCHASED RAY-BAN’S TO TAKE VIDEO, PHOTO. BUT THIS IS NOT A DIRECTION WE ARE GOING TO. WE BELIEVE THAT’S THE GLASSES, STILL FEATURE BASED GLASSES. IT’S NOT AI ORIENTED OR AI NATIVE. THE GLASSES I’M WEARING RIGHT NOW CAPTURE MY VOICE FROM THE MORNING TO THE NIGHT.

1:02:31 AND THEN THE AI KNOWS EVERYTHING ABOUT MYSELF. AVRIL: HOW ARE YOU ADDRESSING PRIVACY CONCERNS THROUGH YOUR DESIGNS? >> REALLY GOOD QUESTION. A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT PRIVACY RIGHT NOW. META RAY-BAN GLASSES BECAUSE OF THE CAMERA. A LOT OF THINGS LIKE A PENDANT OR A RECORDING DEVICE IS ALSO FORBIDDEN IN A LOT OF COUNTRIES. SO RIGHT NOW, THE GLASSES, WE ARE BUILDING RIGHT NOW. ONLY HAS BONE CONDUCTING MICROPHONE TO RECORD EVERY DAY,

1:03:02 ALL DAY LONG VOICES BUT ONLY FOR MYSELF. AVRIL: ONLY YOUR OWN VOICE, NOT THE SURROUNDING. >> IF YOU ARE IN A MEETING, YOU GET CONSENT FROM ALL THE PARTIES OF THE MEETING, YOU CAN TURN IT OFF. PHYSICALLY SWITCH. THEN RIGHT NOW, YOU CAN SEE THERE’S A LIGHT TO INDICATE. OK, I’M TURNING THAT ON. I’M RECORDING EVERYONE. AFTER THE MEETING, I CAN TURN IT OFF. AVRIL: IN TERMS OF YOUR PRODUCT OFFERINGS, YOU WILL NOT BE LOOKING AT SMART GLASSES WITH CAMERAS? >> RIGHT. NO CAMERAS. NO CAMERAS AT ALL.

1:03:35 OUR PRINCIPAL IS, PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO WEAR THE GLASSES ALL DAY LONG. MAKE THE GLASSES PART OF YOURSELF. THE DON’T FEEL THAT IS SMART GLASSES. YOU FEEL LIKE NORMAL GLASSES. THE GLASSES I’M WEARING LIKE 10 YEARS AGO, 20 YEARS AGO. ALSO THE GLASSES LIKE FOR THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU, CAN TELL IT IS SMART GLASSES OR NORMAL GLASSES. WHICH IS REALLY IMPORTANT. WE BELIEVE THE TECHNOLOGY HAS

1:04:08 TO BE AMBIENT, HAS TO BE IMMERSED INTO REAL LIFE. INSTEAD OF MAKING A GADGET. AVRIL: WITH AGENTIC AI IN THE SMART CLASSES, THAT COULD MEAN PEOPLE MAYBE DON’T EVEN NEED TO BUY FUNDS ANYMORE. THAT’S THE IDEA. TALK TO US ABOUT WHAT PRIORITY MARKETS YOU ARE FOCUSING ON. THE MAJOR REVENUE GENERATOR IS STILL THE U.S., HOW ARE YOU VIEWING MARKETS ACROSS THE WORLD INCLUDING IN CHINA? >> 90% OF REVENUE GENERATED OUTSIDE CHINA. 10% IN CHINA.

1:04:40 OUR LARGEST MARKET IS THE U.S.. 50%. OUR REVENUE DOUBLES EVERY YEAR. STILL, OUR MARKET IS U.S. AND EUROPE AND ALSO JAPAN AT FIRST. AND ALSO DEFINITELY WE ARE GOING TO ENTER THE CHINA MARKET. BUT IT’S A LITTLE DIFFERENT. THIS IS LIKE AI ORIENTED PRODUCT. SO IN CHINA, WE NEED TO USE THE CHINA AI. IN THE U.S., WE WILL USE THE USA EITHER. SO IT’S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

1:05:15 ALSO THE DATABASES ALL SEPARATE. EVEN THE ENERGY. ALL SEPARATE. ALL DIFFERENT. SO WE HAVE THE TEAM IN SILICON VALLEY WORKING ON THE BACKEND. ALSO THE SOFTWARE. BUT WE MAKE THE HARDWARE IN CHINA. AVRIL: WHAT ARE YOU SEEING IN TERMS OF MANUFACTURING COSTS, GIVEN THE UPTICK IN MEMORY CHIP PRICES? HOW IS THAT AFFECTING POTENTIAL PROFITABILITY? >> FOR THE MODERN GLASSES, IT’S OK. WE STILL UTILIZE MOST OF THE

1:05:47 COMPUTE POWER FROM THE PHONE. AND FROM THE LAPTOP. SO WE DON’T HAVE LARGE MEMORIES THERE. WE ONLY HAVE THE SOC TO DO THE COMMUNICATION BETWEEN THOSE DEVICES. SO THE MEMORY PRICE SEARCH DOESN’T AFFECT US A LOT. AS MUCH, RIGHT? THE ENTIRE SMART GLASSES SUPPLY CHAIN, MAJORITY IN CHINA. META, THEY ARE MAKING GLASSES IN CHINA. EVEN IPHONE.

1:06:23 THEY ARE ALL MADE IN CHINA. CHINA HAS THE BEST SUPPLY CHAIN FOR THE ENTIRE SMART GLASSES INDUSTRY. AVRIL: YOU MAKE IN CHINA AND THEN YOU EXPORT TO THE REST OF THE WORLD. TALK ABOUT THE PLANS FOR FUTURE FUNDRAISING. WHAT ARE YOU IN THE MARKET FOR? WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR IN TERMS OF FINANCING? >> WE ARE OPEN TO INVESTORS ACROSS THE WORLD BECAUSE WE ARE A GLOBAL COMPANY. WE ARE DOING REALLY CUTTING EDGE TECHNOLOGY. WE BELIEVE IN THE FUTURE, AT

1:06:55 LEAST EVERYONE RIGHT NOW WHO IS WEARING THE GLASSES WILL WEAR THE GLASSES AS SMART GLASSES. SO I THINK THIS IS LIKE A HUGE MARKET. AVRIL: AND REVENUE WOULD BE? >> IMMERSIVE GLASSES, DOUBLED EVERY YEAR. FOR THIS ONE, I BELIEVE AT LEAST THREE TIMES OR FIVE TIMES OR EVEN 10 TIMES. AVRIL: A LOT OF POTENTIAL. WE WILL WATCH THIS SPACE. GREAT TO CHAT WITH YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME TODAY. BACK TO YOU IN THE STUDIO. MINMIN: THANK YOU SO MUCH.

1:07:29 TALKING ABOUT THESE AI SMART GLASSES. PRETTY REMARKABLE THAT YOU CAN’T REALLY TELL. YVONNE: COULDN’T EVEN TELL HE WAS WEARING SMART GLASSES. MINMIN: WE HAD BACK TO THE TOKEN 29 CONFERENCE IN SINGAPORE. LIZ MARTIN JOINS US IN A FEW MINUTES IN A COMPANY’S LATEST PUSH TO REGULATED CRYPTO PRODUCTS. THIS IS BLOOMBERG.

1:08:09 MINMIN: HERE ARE SOME OF THE STORIES WE ARE FOLLOWING TODAY. WALL STREET BONUSES EXPECTED TO HIT AN ALL-TIME HIGH WITH TRADING AND INVESTMENT BANKING FIRMS POISED TO DELIVER RECORD EARNINGS. THE NEW YORK STATE COMPTROLLER SAYS PROFIT IS ON PACE TO EXCEED $90 BILLION, TOPPING LAST YEAR’S RECORD OF 65 BILLION. MAJOR WALL STREET FIRMS HAVE SIGNALED RECORD REVENUE AIDED BY MARKET VOLATILITY AND CONFIDENCE IN DEALMAKING. SPACEX REPORTEDLY LOOKING TO

1:08:40 RAISE $40 BILLION TO BUY THESE NVIDIA CHIPS. THIS REPORT SAYS 10 BILLION OF THAT WILL BE IN BANK LOANS AND THE REST FROM INVESTMENT GRADE DEBT. POLO IS EXPECTED TO LEAD THE DEAL THAT SHOULD CLOSE NEXT YEAR . IT UNDERSCORES THE INSATIABLE DEMAND AMONG AI DEVELOPERS FOR MORE COMPUTING POWER. YVONNE: MOVERS HERE TO TELL YOU ABOUT. REALLY THOUGH URANIUM SHARES YOU ARE SEEING WHEN IT COMES TO AUSTRALIA. THEY ARE REACTING TO THIS GOOGLE CONSTELLATION PACK.

1:09:13 YOU ARE SEEING THE LIKES OF URANIUM SHARES SURGING IN AUSTRALIA RIGHT NOW. ALSO WATCHING PARTS OF THE AI SUPPLY, LOOKING GOOD HERE. IT SEEMS IT REMAINS THE OPTICAL SIDE OF THINGS. TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT WE ARE SEEING IN THE REGION. OPTICAL TECH STOCKS STANDING OUT IN A TIME WHEN YOU ARE NOT SEEING CLEAR TAILWINDS FROM THE U.S. SESSION WITH NVIDIA NOW BACK AT RECORDS. 6 TRILLION MARKET CAP. THIS IS WHERE THE GREEN IS THAT WE ARE SEEING ACROSS THE BOARD HERE. INDONESIAN ASSETS IN FOCUS

1:09:46 AFTER FTSE RUSSELL REITERATED THEIR E.M. STATUS. THEY DID NOT PUT IT ON THE WATCHLIST AS WELL. WE ARE SEEING A BIT OF A PULLBACK IN JAKARTA. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. ♪ YVONNE: 1:29 A.M. IN TOKYO. JAPANESE MARKETS GOING ON BREAK IN A MOMENT. HOVERING AROUND THE 70,000 LEVEL. QUITE A BIT OF A BACK FOOT

1:10:19 THERE. DOWN 9/10 OF 1%. WE ARE SEEING SOME OF THE MORE TECH CENTRIC BENCHMARKS NOT REALLY FEELING IT. DOLLAR-YEN ON THE WEAKER SIDE. YIELDS ARE TICKING LOWER HERE TODAY. U.S. 10 YEAR BOND AUCTION THAT’S IN PLAY LATER ON IN THE U.S. ON WEDNESDAY. BITCOIN GIVES US TIME TO TALK ABOUT WHAT’S BEEN GOING ON THERE. ARE WE IN THE MIDST OF A BULL RUN HERE? IT HAS TRADED WITHOUT MOMENTUM FOR MUCH OF THE YEAR.

1:10:51 WE HAVE SEEN A PRETTY DECENT QUARTER. THE PROSPECT OF TOKENIZED TRADING HAS SPARKED A BIT OF RECOVERY. LET’S BRING IN ANTHONY STEPHENS. >> IT’S BEEN A VOLATILE YEAR. WE’VE HAD THIS KIND OF LONG-RUNNING RALLY SHUTTER TO A HALT IN THE BACK END OF 2025. WE HAVEN’T GOT ANY MOMENTUM GOING EVER SINCE. STUCK IN THIS HUGE RANGE BETWEEN THE HEAD AND SHOULDERS PATTERN HERE AND THE SUPPORT HERE. MOST RECENTLY, WE’VE HAD A LITTLE BIT OF A RALLY PUSHING UP TOWARDS THE TOP END OF THE

1:11:22 RANGE . THAT’S BECAUSE OF THE PROSPECT OF TOKENIZED TRADING, PERHAPS IN EQUITIES. FLIP THE BOARD. WE WILL SEE HOW THAT HAS PLAYED OUT IN THE EQUITY MARKET. HYPER LIQUID GOING BALLISTIC WHILE THE REST OF THE CRYPTO UNIVERSE HAS STRUGGLED TO KEEP UP. IT’S A BIFURCATED MARKET WITH TOKENIZED ASSETS DOING REALLY WELL AND THE TRADITIONAL TRADING OF EXISTING TOKENS STRUGGLING. FLIP THE BOARD. YOU CAN SEE HOW THAT PLAYED OUT INTO ASIA. IT’S BEEN A TOUGH TIME FOR

1:11:53 ASIAN PURVEYORS OF CRYPTO ASSETS YEAR TO DATE. THESE ARE REALLY BIG STRUGGLES ACROSS JAPAN, HONG KONG, SOME OF THE NEW LISTINGS IN HONG KONG AS WELL. VERY EXCITING COMPANY. THIS IS A PRETTY DRASTIC UNDERPERFORMANCE VERSUS WHAT’S ALREADY QUITE A BAD MARKET. WE DO HAVE A LOT OF OPTIMISM IN THE TOKENIZED TRADING ENVIRONMENT. THAT NEEDS TO PASS REGULATION AND BECOME NORMALIZED AND THEN COME TO ASIA TO PERHAPS TURN AROUND SOME OF THESE LOSSES. MINMIN:

1:12:24 THAT WAS OUR BLOOMBERG MARKETS REPORTER. EARLIER, WE SPOKE TO DRAIN A FLAT – DRAGONFLY MANAGING PARTNER FROM THE TOKEN 2049 CONFERENCE IN SINGAPORE. HE TALKED ABOUT HIS OUTLOOK FOR BITCOIN. TAKE A LISTEN. >> NOW RETAIL IS STARTING TO PICK UP ATTENTION AGAIN. TRADING VOLUMES GOING UP. RETAIL INDICATORS STARTING INTO – TO INCREASE AGAIN. YVONNE: YEAH. LET’S HEAD BACK TO 20 – TO OUR NEXT GUEST TO HELPS RUN THE BIGGEST CRYPTO EXCHANGE IN THE U.S..

1:12:57 CERTAINLY TALKING A LOT ABOUT WHAT INVESTOR DEMAND IS LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW. TAKE IT AWAY. >> THAT’S RIGHT. JOINING US EXCLUSIVELY IS THE CO-CEO AT COINBASE INTERNATIONAL. GOOD TO HAVE YOU WITH US. WE’VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT DEMAND. WHAT KIND OF DEMAND ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW? >> WE CONTINUE TO SEE HUGE DEMAND IN CRIB THOUGH AND TOKENIZATION ACROSS THE WORLD. HASLINDA: WHAT’S DRIVING BACK? >> MORE AND MORE PEOPLE THAT ARE LOOKING TO GET INVOLVED

1:13:30 WITH THE TRANSPARENCY THAT WE HAVE SEEN THROUGH INCREASED REGULATION. WE ARE SEEING INSTITUTIONS MORE EXCITED TO BRING MONEY TO THE TABLE. USED TO BE, DO I WANT TO BE IN CRYPTO? NOW IT’S LIKE, HOW DO I GET BIGGER? HASLINDA: JUST THIS MORNING, YOU MADE AN ANNOUNCEMENT. COINBASE HAS INTEGRATED ITS –. SOMETHING YOU ACQUIRED FOR $2.9 BILLION. TALK TO US ABOUT THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THAT. >> WE RCEP – SUPER EXCITED OF COMPLETING THE INTEGRATION OF

1:14:01 THE WORLD’S LARGEST CRYPTO OPTION EXCHANGE. WITH THAT, WE HAVE CREATED COINBASE GLOBAL EXCHANGE WHICH IS THE FIRST AND ONLY CRYPTO EXCHANGE AROUND THE WORLD THAT HAS A UNIFIED LOCAL LIQUIDITY. ABLE TO BRING U.S. CUSTOMERS, INTERNATIONAL CUSTOMERS INTO ONE PLACE AND NO ONE ELSE CAN REALLY DO THAT. HASLINDA: THAT’S JUST IT. WHAT IS IT THAT CAN – THAT IT CAN DO THAT OTHERS CAN REPLICATE? HOW DIFFICULT IS IT TO GET THERE? >> TRADITIONALLY CRYPTO MARKETS HAVE BEEN FRAGMENTED BY REGULATION. THERE’S REALLY NO UNIFIED

1:14:35 LIQUIDITY POOL GLOBALLY WHERE U.S. INVESTORS AND INTERNATIONAL INVENTORS – INVESTORS CAN TRADE. WE’VE REALLY CREATED THAT, WORKING WITH REGULATORS IN BOTH JURISDICTIONS AND UP RATING THE TECHNOLOGY TO CREATE THE COINBASE GLOBAL EXCHANGE. HASLINDA: HOW SEAMLESS MIGHT THAT BE? SOME SAY REGULATORY FRICTION MIGHT BE IN THE WAY. >> WE HAVE GREAT RELATIONSHIPS WITH OUR REGULATORS AROUND THE WORLD. WE’VE BEEN ABLE TO SEE THAT AS AN ACCELERANT OF THE TYPES OF THINGS WE HAPPEN ABLE TO DO AND NOT A DETRACTOR. HASLINDA: THE OBLIGATIONS FOR THE

1:15:09 BUSINESS, THE VOLUMES. WHAT MIGHT THAT LOOK LIKE DOWN THE ROAD? >> WE ARE BRINGING TOGETHER OUR STRONG U.S. RETAIL BASE WITH OUR INTERNATIONAL BASE AND WE HAVE COMBINED THAT WITH A REAL UPGRADE OF OUR TOOLS FOR PROFESSIONAL TRADERS CALLED COINBASE ADVANCED. SO WE THINK THAT COMBINED WITH THE FACT THAT WE ARE LAUNCHING SPARK MARGIN – SPOT MARGIN AND OPTIONS FOR OUR PERPETRATORS IN A UNIFIED PORTFOLIO WHERE THEY

1:15:41 CAN GET MAXIMUM BUYING POWER AND LOWER FEES. WE HAVE SUPER AMBITIOUS VOLUME GROWTH. HASLINDA: WHEN IT COMES TO REVENUE, THERE ARE SOME VIEWS THAT PERHAPS COINBASE NEEDS TO DIVERSIFY ITS REVENUE STREAMS. HOW IS THE COMPANY LOOKING AT THAT? >> COINBASE IS BUILDING THE EVERYTHING EXCHANGE. OVER THE PAST YEAR, WE ADDED EQUITIES, EQUITY OPTIONS, PERPETUAL FUTURES AND EQUITIES, IPOS, COMMODITIES, PREDICTION

1:16:13 MARKETS. SO WE ARE ACTIVELY DIVERSIFYING OUR REVENUE STREAMS BY ADDING PRODUCTS UNDER THE EVERYTHING EXCHANGE. HASLINDA: YOU TALKED ABOUT HOW THAT COULD BE SO MANY GROWTH DRIVERS. WHAT MIGHT BE THE LEADING ONE? WHAT NUMBERS ARE YOU LOOKING AT? WHAT KIND OF GROWTH ARE WE ANTICIPATING? >> ARE BIG RAT – THAT IS OUR COINBASE GLOBAL EXCHANGE AND ARE LAUNCH OF COINBASE ADVANCED IN COINBASE PRO. WE REALLY BELIEVE WE ARE THE MOST TRUSTED AS WELL AS THE MOST COMPLETE TRADING PLATFORM IN THE WORLD. HASLINDA:

1:16:48 YOU ARE BETTING ON THE PREDICTION MARKET AS WELL. THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT HOW IT’S ON ITS WAY TO PERHAPS GETTING TO $1 TRILLION IN TERMS OF VOLUME. WILL IT GET THERE? WHAT IS YOUR TAKE ON IT? >> ABSOLUTELY. WE ARE MAKING BIG BETS AND PREDICTION MARKETS. WE NOW HAVE A CLEARING PLATFORM FOR PREDICTION MARKETS IN THE U.S. AND OUR INTENTIONS TO LAUNCH OUR OWN PREDICTION MARKETS OVERALL. MAKING BIG BUCKS. UNITIES – UNIQUE DERIVATIVES. >> HOW QUICKLY DO YOU THINK WE CAN GET TO $1 TRILLION?

1:17:22 >> I DON’T HAVE A CRYSTAL BALL. I WOULD SAY THE GROWTH RATES ARE REALLY FAST. >> LET’S TALK ABOUT COINBASE’S EXPANSION PLANS. I KNOW IT’S BIG ON THAT. WHERE SHOULD WE BE ANTICIPATING COINBASE EXPANDING TO IN TERMS OF ITS OWN WORKFORCE? WHERE ARE YOU WITH THAT? >> WE ARE SUPER EXCITED TO BE HERE IN A PACK. WE DEFINITELY SEE THIS REGION AS A MAJOR GROWTH AREA FOR US. WE JUST OPENED A NEW HEADQUARTERS IN SINGAPORE HERE

1:17:53 JUST ABOUT TWO MONTHS AGO. WE’VE ACQUIRED LICENSES IN INDIA. OVERALL, THE AIPAC REGION IS A MASSIVE GROWTH AREA BOTH BECOME – BECAUSE IT IS NEWER FOR COINBASE AND THERE ARE SO MANY PROFESSIONAL TRADERS THAT WE ARE EXCITED TO WORK WITH. HASLINDA: LOTS OF COMPETITION. WHAT IS YOUR MODE? >> WHAT WE ARE DOING RIGHT NOW. WE ARE ABLE TO BRING THE U.S. CUSTOMER BASE INTO A UNIFIED GLOBAL QUIDDITY POOL. WE HAVE BUILT NEXT-GENERATION TOOLS FOR PRO TRADERS WITH

1:18:25 COINBASE ADVANCED. THAT’S OUR MODE. HASLINDA: WHEN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT WHERE CAPITAL IS HEADING RIGHT NOW, AI IS SOAKING MOST OF IT. HOW MIGHT THIS RESHAPE THE CRYPTO SPACE? >> WE ARE ACTIVE IN THE AI MARKET. AIM CRYPTO ARE COMING TOGETHER. ONE OF THE THINGS WE ARE MOST EXCITED ABOUT IS THE ABILITY FOR AGENTS TO TRADE. AS PART OF OUR INVESTMENT IN COINBASE ADVANCED, WE’VE ALSO UPGRADED ALL OF OUR APIS. HASLINDA:

1:18:58 WHAT OTHER TRENDS MIGHT BE DEVELOPING IN THE COMING YEARS? >> IN AI. THE OTHER BIG TREND IS TOKENIZATION. WE RECENTLY JUST LAUNCHED TOKENIZED EQUITIES FOR CUSTOMERS OUTSIDE THE U.S.. THIS IS ACTUALLY OWNING THE STOCK. IT’S NOT A DERIVATIVE. YOU GET ALL THE SAME SHAREHOLDER RIGHTS. WHAT WE SEE THEIR’S DEMAND FOR NOT U.S. INVESTORS TO GET ACCESS TO U.S. STOCKS. WE THINK THAT CONTINUAL GROWTH IN THAT SPACE AND OVERALL TOKENIZATION IS THE NEXT THING.

1:19:29 HASLINDA: BUT THERE ARE SOME ISSUES WITH TOKENIZATION. SOME COMPANIES LIKE AMC HAVE TAKEN ISSUE WITH HOW SHARES HAVE BEEN TOKENIZED AND IT’S NOT EXACTLY WHAT THEY WANT. HOW MIGHT THIS PLAY OUT? >> WHAT WE’VE DONE IS CREATED A ONE-FOR-ONE PRODUCT. THE SHARES ARE HELD IN A REGULATED CUSTODIAN, GIVING PEOPLE THE SAME RIGHTS AS A – AS ACTUAL OWNERSHIP OF THE STOCK. ADDITIONALLY, WE ARE WORKING WITH U.S. REGULATORS. S.E.C. ANNOUNCED THE GROWTH OF TOKENIZED EQUITIES IN THE U.S..

1:20:04 SO WE THINK THAT IN WORKING WITH REGULATORS IN BOTH JURISDICTIONS, WE CAN AVOID THE TYPES OF THINGS YOU JUST MENTIONED. HASLINDA: WHAT’S THE TREND? ARE MORE AND MORE COMPANIES WANTING TO TOKENIZED OR NOT? IT’S AGAINST THE BACKDROP OF QUITE A LOT OF LAWSUITS, RIGHT? >> THE BIG TRENDS WE SEE IN OUR BUSINESS IS RETAIL DEMAND TO TRADE THINGS IN TOKENIZED FORM. TWO, INSTITUTIONAL DEMAND TO BE ABLE TO USE TOKENIZATION AS A WAY TO REALLY UPGRADE FINANCIAL INFRASTRUCTURE. MORE THAN TWO THIRDS OF OUR

1:20:37 ASSET MANAGEMENT COMMUNITY IS INTERESTED IN USING TOKENIZATION TO DISTRIBUTE THEIR FUNDS. WE ALSO FIND BIG DEMAND IN PEOPLE USING TOKENIZATION TO MOVE COLLATERAL AROUND THE WORLD 24/7, 365. THOSE ARE THE BIG TRENDS WE SEE IN TOKENIZATION. HASLINDA: YOU TALKED ABOUT INSTITUTIONAL DEMAND. WHAT ARE WE SEEING THEIR? THERE HAS BEEN A BLURRING OF LINES BETWEEN TRADITIONAL FINANCE AND DIGITAL SPACE. DO YOU SEE BOTH COMING TOGETHER AT SOME POINT?

1:21:11 >> INSTITUTIONS CAN’T AVOID THE SPACE AND ARE SUPER EXCITED ABOUT IT. WE ALSO SEE ABOUT 60% OF OUR INSTITUTIONAL CLIENTS ARE EXCITED ABOUT TOKENIZATION AND INVESTING IN TOKENIZED ASSETS. WE LOOK AT THIS THROUGH SURVEYS WE CONDUCT. I THINK WE CONTINUE TO SEE THAT INSTITUTIONS WANT TO BRING MORE ASSETS ON TRAIN – CHAIN. THE CRYPTO COMMUNITY IS TRYING TO INSTITUTIONALIZE ISAAC ROSE. HASLINDA: FIGURE POINT, WE ARE SEEING 24/7 TRADED.

1:21:43 SOME ARE SPECULATING THAT WE COULD SEE THE END OF TRADITIONAL EXCHANGES. IF I WERE NASDAQ, I WOULD BE THINKING ABOUT THE STRATEGY. >> I DON’T THINK YOU WILL SEE THE END OF EXCHANGES. YOU WILL JUST SEE MORE AND MORE BLENDING. AT COINBASE, WE LIKE TO BE THE BRIDGE BETWEEN TRADITIONAL AND BRINGING MORE ASSETS ON CHANGE. THAT’S A UNIQUE OPPORTUNITY FOR US. HASLINDA: WHAT ARE YOU EXCITED ABOUT WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE FUTURE? HOW TRADITIONAL FINANCE IS GETTING INTO BLOCKCHAIN AND HOW THEY ARE ADOPTING SOME OF THE

1:22:18 PRACTICES THAT THE DIGITAL SPACE IS ACTUALLY – >> I’M JUST EXCITED FOR GROWTH OVERALL. THAT’S WHY WE HAVE MADE SIGNIFICANT TECHNOLOGY INVESTMENTS. WE WANT TO BE THE MOST COMPLETE TRADING PLATFORM FOR CRYPTO AND THE WORLD. I’M JUST EXCITED ABOUT GROWTH. HASLINDA: WE THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME TODAY. OF COURSE, WE HAVE PLENTY MORE CONVERSATIONS HERE AT WHAT – TOKEN 2049. 25,000 PARTICIPANTS, MOVERS AND

1:22:50 SHAKERS. YOU DON’T WANT TO MISS THE CONVERSATIONS. MINMIN: MORE INTERVIEWS COMING UP FROM TOKEN 2049. HASLINDA AMIN THERE TO DISCUSS THE OUTLOOK FOR DIGITAL ASSETS. FRANKLIN TEMPLETON’S CRYPTO HIT LATER AT THE 11TH HOUR. YVONNE: IT’S A JAMPACKED SHOW. LATER TODAY, THE IMF CHIEF JOINS US LIVE TO DISCUSS THE GLOBAL GROWTH OUTLOOK, TRADE TENSIONS, AND THE PATH OR INTEREST RATES. CATCH THE INTERVIEW AT THE TIMES ON YOUR SCREEN.

1:23:20 PLENTY MORE AHEAD. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. MINMIN: NDS CENTRAL BANK IS EXPECTED TO DELIVER ITS FIRST RATE HIKE IN NEARLY FOUR YEARS TODAY AS POLICYMAKERS CONFRONT RISING INFLATION, A WEAKER RUBY, AND HIGHER OIL PRICES.

1:23:50 YOU CAN SEE ON THIS CHART, A SURVEY OF ECONOMISTS, 35 EXPECTING A HIKE AND ONLY SIX EXPECTING A HOLD. OUR BLOOMBERG ECONOMICS TEAM HAS A NON-CONSENSUS CALL. YVONNE: IT’S INTERESTING. THEY ARE GOING AGAINST THE GRAIN AND SAYING, MAY BE CENTRAL BANK HAS TIME AND CAN AFFORD TO HOLD UNTIL DECEMBER. THEY ARE SAYING WHEN IT COMES TO INFLATION, WELL WITHIN THE TARGET BAND RATE. SO IF THEY WAIT UNTIL DECEMBER, MAYBE THEY CAN AVOID A SLOW DOWN HERE AND THEY CAN ASSESS WHAT YOU SEE WHEN IT COMES TO

1:24:24 THE AUTUMN HARVEST AS WELL. THIS IRAN WAR AND HOW IT PLAYS OUT AS WELL. LET’S BRING IN –, JOINING US FROM THEM BY GET HOW CLOSE OF A CALL IS THIS – WILL BUY. HOW CLOSE OF A DECISION IS THIS? >> THE CONSENSUS IS THAT MOST ECONOMIES ARE EXPECTING A RATE HIKE THIS TIME. WHEREAS BLOOMBERG ECONOMICS SAYS THAT THERE WOULD BE A PAUSE. THEY HAVE GOOD REASONS TO SAY

1:24:55 THAT HEARING INFLATION IS STILL WITHIN THE R.B.I. 6% RANGE. AT THE SAME TIME, THE ECONOMISTS ARE SAYING THAT INFLATION WILL GO UP TO NEAR 6% LEVEL OR MAYBE EVEN CROSS THAT IN THE DECEMBER QUARTER. A RATE HIKE NOW MAY PREVENT ANY SPIKE IN PRICE PRESSURES LATER IN THE QUARTER. ALSO, GIVEN THAT THE RUPEE IS UNDER PRESSURE AND A LOT OF OUTFLOWS ARE TAKING PLACE IN THE MARKET, MAYBE A RATE HIKE NOW FOLLOWING THE SEPTEMBER RATE HIKE WILL SET THE MARKET

1:25:29 AND A GOOD STATE. MINMIN: WHAT WILL YOU BE WATCHING OUT FOR WHEN IT COMES TO THE POLICY STATEMENT? >> YES. SO I WILL BE WATCHING OUT FOR AND ALSO THE ECONOMY WILL BE WATCHING OUT FOR LIQUIDITY MEASURES. THE SYSTEM LIQUIDITY IS IN HUGE SURPLUS AFTER THE SCHEME. SO R.B.I. IS EXPECTED TO ANNOUNCE MEASURES THAT WILL TRAIN LIQUIDITY FROM THE SYSTEM. THERE COULD BE A CALENDAR FOR SECONDARY MARKET BOND SALES IN

1:26:02 THE MARKET AND ALSO THE CURRENCY SWAPS. AND ANY OTHER KIND OF COMMENT ON LIQUIDITY WILL BE HELPFUL. THE INFLATION GROWTH FORECAST FOR THE REST OF THE FISCAL YEAR. MINMIN: THANK YOU. OUR BLOOMBERG SOUTH ASIA ECONOMY AND GOVERNMENT REPORTER IN MUMB AI. SUBSCRIBERS CAN TURN TO THE TERMINAL FOR THIS. THE LATEST UPDATES PLUS COMMENTARY AND ANALYSIS FROM

1:26:33 OUR EXPERT EDITORS. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. MINMIN: JPMORGAN CHASE CEO JAMIE DIMON SAYS CYBERSECURITY REMAINS HIS BIGGEST CONCERN AS ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE CREATES NEW RISK AND VULNERABILITIES. HE ALSO WEIGHED IN ON THE GROWING TENSIONS SURROUNDING

1:27:04 DATA CENTER EXPANSION. >> THIS CONFERENCE USED TO BE 20 PEOPLE. NOW IT’S 2000 INVESTORS AND HUNDREDS OF COMPANIES AROUND THE WORLD. IT’S A POSITIVE SIGN OF TAX ABILITY TO EXPAND. IT’S NOT JUST SILICON VALLEY ANYMORE. IT’S EVERYWHERE. A LOT OF THESE COMPANIES ARE REAL. THEY HELP THINGS – INVENT THINGS THAT WILL HELP MANKIND. THAT FINANCING IS A SHORT-TERM ISSUE. RATES ARE GOING UP. A LOT OF DEMAND FOR CAPITAL. A LOT OF GOVERNMENT FINANCING.

1:27:38 IN MY VIEW, LITTLE BIT EXPECTED. IT GOES UP HIGHER. THE CREDIT SPREADS GAP. IT IS GREAT FOR ALL COMPANIES. THEY ARE CHANGING VALUATIONS. THE MARKET OPENS AND CLOSES. THERE IS NO PERMANENT STATE OF AFFAIRS WHEN IT COMES TO MARKETS. >> WE ARE SEEING INCREASED COMPETITION FOR CAPITAL. LAYERING THAT ON TOP OF THE FORECAST FOR AI, WHAT IS THE POTENTIAL BIGGEST RISK TO THAT FORECAST? PHYSICAL BUILDOUT, MONETIZATION?

1:28:11 IS IT THE LOSS OF CAPITAL? IS IT SOMETHING ELSE? >> IT’S ALL OF THOSE THINGS. WHEN WE WENT TO THE INTERNET, AND TOTALLY PAYS OFF. THERE WILL BE BETTER MODELS, BETTER SEMICONDUCTORS, CHANGING SCHEDULES, LAWSUITS ABOUT DATA CENTERS. MOST OF THEM WILL GET BILLED. THEY WILL BE BUILT WHERE PEOPLE WANT THEM AS OPPOSED TO WHERE PEOPLE DON’T WANT THEM. THEY WILL BE USED. AI CREATES A LOT OF VALUE. I’M NOT WORRIED ABOUT IT. YOU DO POINT OUT, IT’S A LOT OF ADDITIONAL BORROWING.

1:28:44 I DON’T KNOW IF THE BORROWING IS A TRILLION. THERE’S A LOT OF BORROWING. THE GOVERNMENT IS BORROWING $2 TRILLION AGAIN. THIS IS A GLOBAL PHENOMENON. THIS IS SUPPLY AND DEMAND OF CAPITAL. IF YOU THOUGHT THERE WAS A SAVING GLUT YEARS AGO, NOW THERE’S NOT. IT COULD BE A GOOD THING. RATES ARE GOING UP. THE PROBLEM IN PART IS THE GOVERNMENT, CONSUMPTION. THAT’S A DIFFERENT THING. OF COURSE, GOVERNMENT SPENDING CAN DRIVE INFLATION. IT COULD BE A FLIP OF HOW THIS PLAYS OUT.

1:29:18 >> YOU MENTIONED THE POLITICS OF AI. WHAT WOULD BE YOUR ADVICE TO GOVERNMENTS IN TERMS OF HOW TO RESOLVE POLITICS OF AI AND ADDRESS THOSE TAIL RISKS? >> THESE ARE DIFFERENT ISSUES. DATA CENTERS, YOU BUILD THEM WHERE THEY ARE WANTED. HALF OF THE NEW ONES IN AMERICA, TEXAS AND VIRGINIA. PEOPLE DON’T WANT THEM. THERE ARE A LOT OF STATES WHO HAVE ACCESS TO POWER. ANY BIG COMPANY HAS TO BE A GOOD COMMUNITY CITIZEN.

1:29:49 A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE ARE GOING INTO TOWN AND BEING A PART OF THE COMMUNITY. THEY GET THE RIGHTS. THEY MAKE COMMITMENTS. CONSUMER ELECTRICITY COSTS. THIS IS LIKE THAT. THAT WILL BE WORKED THROUGH. AI HAS A HUGE POSITIVE EFFECT. IT WILL CURE A LOT OF DISEASES. IT WILL GIVE SAFE ACCESS TO THE ROADS AND COMPOSITE MATERIALS. IT WILL MAKE LIFE UNBELIEVABLE FOR PEOPLE. THE DOWNSIDE IS OBVIOUSLY WHAT YOU READ ABOUT WITH THE AGENTS AND MYTHOS AND ALL THESE THINGS. THAT’S A LEGITIMATE CONCERN.

1:30:23 I’M NOT GETTING HYSTERICAL IF IT IS EXISTENTIAL OR NOT. WE ARE ROLLING UP OUR SLEEVES AND GOING TO WORK TO FIX IT. THE BANKS HAVE ALWAYS HAD A SYSTEM IN PLACE WHERE YOU HELP EACH OTHER. WE STARTED THE ALLIANCE FOR CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE. IT STARTED IN THE U.S.. IT’S ACROSS SIX INDUSTRIES. TECH, FINANCIAL SERVICES, WATER, TRANSPORT. EVENTUALLY, IT SHOULD PROBABLY EXPAND TO HEALTH CARE, PHARMA, AGRICULTURAL. EVERY INDUSTRY IS CRITICAL.

1:30:55 WE NEED TO HELP THE SMALLER COMPANIES TWO. THEY HAVE DIFFERENT VENDORS IN DIFFERENT NEEDS. IT’S A LOT OF WORK. WE SIMPLY HAVE TO DO IT. AI CREATED VULNERABILITIES THAT WE DIDN’T KNOW ABOUT. >> YOU’VE THOUGHT ABOUT CYBER RISKS FOR A LONG TIME. DOES AI MAKE CYBER SYSTEMIC RISKS MORE LIKELY? >> THAT’S WHAT I’M SAYING. MYTHOS. WHATEVER YOU THOUGHT IT WAS BEFORE. I SAID, CYBER IS OUR BIGGEST RISK.

1:31:27 THEY DIDN’T PUBLISH MYTHOS YET. IT WENT UP TENFOLD AFTER MYTHOS. YVONNE: THAT WAS JPMORGAN CHASE CHAIRMAN AND CEO WITH TOM MACKENZIE TALKING ALL THINGS AI. WE ARE WATCHING SOUTHEAST ASIAN BANKS IN PARTICULAR TODAY. MOST OF THEM ARE FALLING QUITE A LOT ACCORDING TO JP MORGAN. HIGHER BOND YIELDS NOW STARTING TO REALLY ROYAL THE SECTOR HERE. JUST GIVEN WHAT WE’VE BEEN SEEING. THEY SHOULD HELP THEY’RE NOT ASKED – NET INTEREST MARGINS. AT WHAT POINT DOES THAT BECOME SOMETHING OF A NEGATIVE STORY? WE ARE SEEING THAT FELT HERE

1:32:01 TODAY. OTHERWISE, WE ARE WATCHING THE HEALTH CARE SECTOR. DOUBLE-DIGIT LOSSES FOR THE LIKES OF JEN SCRIPT. SCALPING HOLDINGS. JEN SCRIPT. THIS IS A STOCK THAT HAS BEEN A RETAIL FAVORITE. INVESTOR DARLING REALLY. THE LAST YEAR OR SO, BASICALLY HAS SURGED MORE THAN 180% OR SO. COMING OFF OF THAT JUST SLIGHTLY HERE TODAY. HSTECH IS LOOKING LIKE THIS. MORE MOMENTUM TO THE DOWNSIDE

1:32:31 FOR ALIBABA. THE CHIPMAKERS AREN’T DOING WELL EITHER. TENCENT, XIAOMI. WE ARE FOCUSING WHEN IT COMES TO DEEPSEEK. ACCORDING TO OUR SOURCES, $12 BILLION IS NOT ENOUGH TO TURN AROUND THE AI TRADE HERE TODAY. TOMORROW, MAYBE WE GET MORE SUPPORT FROM THE SOUTHBOUND FLOWS THERE. MAINLAND CHINA MARKETS REOPEN ON THURSDAY AS WELL. R.B.I. DECISION UNDERWAY IN THE NEXT HOUR. THAT’S IT FOR US HERE IN THE CHINA SHOW.